Background:
The SFC participates in various Open Source conference and often has a booth. If they have a booth they'd like to have Inkscape promotional items in the booth (stickers, etc.) to help promote Inkscape. This helps the project in getting name recognition and representation at conferences that we're otherwise not attending. Previously we've done approvals on a per-event basis, which has worked, but thinking it makes more sense to approve this as an open item so the SFC can manage their inventory as needed. Proposal: a. Approve up to $300 for the SFC to purchase Inkscape promotional items. b. Approve a different amount of: ________ c. Do not approve any budget for promotional items
Timeline: Opening: 2022-08-05 Closing: 2022-08-12
Ted
I vote c.
This proposal pushes out our vectors team, who shouldn't be excluded from talking about how Inkscape is marketed, it is their job. I would approve a budget proposed by Ryan and the other vectors for this exact thing if they saw it as something we should do. I feel like this hasn't gone through the proper channels. There's no designs proposed, or plans for what the money would be used for.
Secondarily: While getting Inkscape's name out there is a good idea, there's no events that the SFC attends that do not already know about Inkscape. This could be seen as preferential treatment for nerdy Inkscapers who go to SCaLEx, while your regular artsy Inkscaper has no way to access cool stickers.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Fri, 5 Aug 2022 at 11:57, Ted Gould ted@gould.cx wrote:
Background:
The SFC participates in various Open Source conference and often has a booth. If they have a booth they'd like to have Inkscape promotional items in the booth (stickers, etc.) to help promote Inkscape. This helps the project in getting name recognition and representation at conferences that we're otherwise not attending.
Previously we've done approvals on a per-event basis, which has worked, but thinking it makes more sense to approve this as an open item so the SFC can manage their inventory as needed.
Proposal:
a. Approve up to $300 for the SFC to purchase Inkscape promotional items. b. Approve a different amount of: ________ c. Do not approve any budget for promotional items
Timeline:
Opening: 2022-08-05 Closing: 2022-08-12
Ted
Inkscape Board of Directors mailing list -- inkscape-board@lists.inkscape.org To unsubscribe send an email to inkscape-board-leave@lists.inkscape.org
On Aug 5 2022, at 11:22 am, Martin Owens doctormo@gmail.com wrote:
This proposal pushes out our vectors team, who shouldn't be excluded from talking about how Inkscape is marketed, it is their job. I would approve a budget proposed by Ryan and the other vectors for this exact thing if they saw it as something we should do. I feel like this hasn't gone through the proper channels. There's no designs proposed, or plans for what the money would be used for.
I think that "pushes out" is overly dramatic. But it doesn't directly involve them, do you think a process where they'd have to approve the designs would be better? I think that the SFC has been asking them in the past to ensure they got the latest logos, but I could see formalizing that. It also doesn't limit Vectors from doing additional promotional items for other events, or even the same ones!
Secondarily: While getting Inkscape's name out there is a good idea, there's no events that the SFC attends that do not already know about Inkscape.
Sadly, this hasn't been my experience. I still find myself explaining what Inkscape is even at OSS events. I think it depends on where you come to OSS from. If you've only learned about OSS software through Kubernetes you have a different expectation then if you're running an OSS Desktop. I even had someone who was shocked when I implied that OSS software could exist somewhere else than Github. I'm surprised how much education is required "in our community," which is probably good as it means that it is adding new people, but our onboarding process isn't good 😄
This could be seen as preferential treatment for nerdy Inkscapers who go to SCaLEx, while your regular artsy Inkscaper has no way to access cool stickers.
That's a rather zero sum way of looking at it. It is a way for folks that go to OSS events to get stickers, yes, but that doesn't preclude us doing other events that get stickers to other folks. If we find a vector to do that, I would suggest we do that as well! Ted
On Fri, 5 Aug 2022 at 12:55, Ted Gould ted@gould.cx wrote:
do you think a process where they'd have to approve the designs would be better?
I think a project with people who have defined roles should come with a short sit down with the people involved. You didn't have to spend months planning out design briefs, just a short conversation in the vectors chat channel, perhaps at their meeting tomorrow. Because there are some functions we shouldn't short circuit, it creates a feeling that our contributors aren't respected when we go over their heads to approve marketing budgets, without the marketing team's involvement.
Martin,
On Aug 5 2022, at 12:36 pm, Martin Owens doctormo@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, 5 Aug 2022 at 12:55, Ted Gould ted@gould.cx wrote:
do you think a process where they'd have to approve the designs would be better?
I think a project with people who have defined roles should come with a short sit down with the people involved. You didn't have to spend months planning out design briefs, just a short conversation in the vectors chat channel, perhaps at their meeting tomorrow. Because there are some functions we shouldn't short circuit, it creates a feeling that our contributors aren't respected when we go over their heads to approve marketing budgets, without the marketing team's involvement.
So instead of attacking others and claiming malfeasance, why don't you do that outreach and base your vote on what they say. Saying 'no' before consulting Vectors is also making a marketing decision without their consultation in the same regard. This is why the PLC has multiple members and week long votes, so all those opinions can get included. Calling a vote isn't making a decision. The decision is made when the vote concludes. Ted
I agree with Martin that it's probably best to consult the Vector's team before having a vote, out of respect for their function as the marketing and outreach voice of Inkscape. I can't say for certain that they'd like to do another round of stickers we've had in the past, or make new ones. And yes, they should vote on and approve the budget (especially an ongoing one). I think we all sort of agreed on that before all the video stuff was approved as well.
-C
On Fri, Aug 5, 2022 at 7:10 PM Ted Gould ted@gould.cx wrote:
On Aug 5 2022, at 12:36 pm, Martin Owens doctormo@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, 5 Aug 2022 at 12:55, Ted Gould ted@gould.cx wrote:
do you think a process where they'd have to approve the designs would be
better?
I think a project with people who have defined roles should come with a short sit down with the people involved. You didn't have to spend months planning out design briefs, just a short conversation in the vectors chat channel, perhaps at their meeting tomorrow. Because there are some functions we shouldn't short circuit, it creates a feeling that our contributors aren't respected when we go over their heads to approve marketing budgets, without the marketing team's involvement.
So instead of attacking others and claiming malfeasance, why don't you do that outreach and base your vote on what they say. Saying 'no' before consulting Vectors is also making a marketing decision without their consultation in the same regard.
This is why the PLC has multiple members and week long votes, so all those opinions can get included. Calling a vote isn't making a decision. The decision is made when the vote concludes.
Ted
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A condensed view from the vectors team yesterday:
* This is a lot of money for just stickers, but they understand that it's a budget for more than just stickers. * Some members question why the SFC should be in charge of marketing Inkscape and not Inkscape. * It is not a problematic amount of money and will not impact Inkscape's or the vector's budgeting plans. * The PLC should require the SFC to report on how they are spending the money, please report back so the costs of goods are understood. * There are no problems with any designs the SFC might choose to use. The inkscape logo and some other various designs are available. * The Vector's team wishes to have stickers it can use at other events. There was more discussion about how to achieve this which is outside of the scope of this vote.
I maintain my view that this vote should have touched the vectors team before going to a PLC vote, having to do this leg work to fill in the social connection between teams has made me very unhappy, which is probably obvious. I feel it's deeply unfair that there are only a few PLC members who are active in keeping the wider Inkscape cohesion together. If we wish to have an open source project that is bigger than one or two people, we must show respect to the specialisations and expertise of the people we have invited to help us.
Regards, Martin
I think it's nice that the SFC is thinking about us while they are out handing out materials. Providing the SFC report back the spending to the Vectors as requested, and providing the Vectors are consulted next time before a vote is made, I see no issue with voting A.
I'll thus vote A to approve the budget this time.
Thanks Martin for your extra work here. -C
On Sun, Aug 7, 2022 at 5:31 PM Martin Owens doctormo@gmail.com wrote:
A condensed view from the vectors team yesterday:
- This is a lot of money for just stickers, but they understand that
it's a budget for more than just stickers.
- Some members question why the SFC should be in charge of marketing
Inkscape and not Inkscape.
- It is not a problematic amount of money and will not impact
Inkscape's or the vector's budgeting plans.
- The PLC should require the SFC to report on how they are spending
the money, please report back so the costs of goods are understood.
- There are no problems with any designs the SFC might choose to use.
The inkscape logo and some other various designs are available.
- The Vector's team wishes to have stickers it can use at other
events. There was more discussion about how to achieve this which is outside of the scope of this vote.
I maintain my view that this vote should have touched the vectors team before going to a PLC vote, having to do this leg work to fill in the social connection between teams has made me very unhappy, which is probably obvious. I feel it's deeply unfair that there are only a few PLC members who are active in keeping the wider Inkscape cohesion together. If we wish to have an open source project that is bigger than one or two people, we must show respect to the specialisations and expertise of the people we have invited to help us.
Regards, Martin
a
On 8/10/22 20:26, C R wrote:
I think it's nice that the SFC is thinking about us while they are out handing out materials. Providing the SFC report back the spending to the Vectors as requested, and providing the Vectors are consulted next time before a vote is made, I see no issue with voting A.
I'll thus vote A to approve the budget this time.
Thanks Martin for your extra work here. -C
On Sun, Aug 7, 2022 at 5:31 PM Martin Owens doctormo@gmail.com wrote:
A condensed view from the vectors team yesterday:
- This is a lot of money for just stickers, but they understand that
it's a budget for more than just stickers.
- Some members question why the SFC should be in charge of marketing
Inkscape and not Inkscape.
- It is not a problematic amount of money and will not impact
Inkscape's or the vector's budgeting plans.
- The PLC should require the SFC to report on how they are spending
the money, please report back so the costs of goods are understood.
- There are no problems with any designs the SFC might choose to use.
The inkscape logo and some other various designs are available.
- The Vector's team wishes to have stickers it can use at other
events. There was more discussion about how to achieve this which is outside of the scope of this vote.
I maintain my view that this vote should have touched the vectors team before going to a PLC vote, having to do this leg work to fill in the social connection between teams has made me very unhappy, which is probably obvious. I feel it's deeply unfair that there are only a few PLC members who are active in keeping the wider Inkscape cohesion together. If we wish to have an open source project that is bigger than one or two people, we must show respect to the specialisations and expertise of the people we have invited to help us.
Regards, Martin
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Sorry, just catching up on non-scale email, hopefully this isn't too late. I vote a.
Cheers, Josh
On Fri, Aug 5, 2022 at 8:57 AM Ted Gould ted@gould.cx wrote:
Background:
The SFC participates in various Open Source conference and often has a booth. If they have a booth they'd like to have Inkscape promotional items in the booth (stickers, etc.) to help promote Inkscape. This helps the project in getting name recognition and representation at conferences that we're otherwise not attending.
Previously we've done approvals on a per-event basis, which has worked, but thinking it makes more sense to approve this as an open item so the SFC can manage their inventory as needed.
Proposal:
a. Approve up to $300 for the SFC to purchase Inkscape promotional items. b. Approve a different amount of: ________ c. Do not approve any budget for promotional items
Timeline:
Opening: 2022-08-05 Closing: 2022-08-12
Ted
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Ha, well you're more caught up than me. So I guess that means it isn't too late 😄
Closing this vote out, I vote A. Which finalizes the tally at: Josh Andler: a Tavmjong Bah: - Ted Gould: a Martin Owens: c Marc Jeanmougin: a Chris Rogers: a
Which means that the resolution passes. I'll let the SFC know. Ted On Aug 13 2022, at 4:26 pm, Josh Andler scislac@gmail.com wrote:
Sorry, just catching up on non-scale email, hopefully this isn't too late. I vote a.
Cheers, Josh
On Fri, Aug 5, 2022 at 8:57 AM Ted Gould <ted@gould.cx (mailto:ted@gould.cx)> wrote:
Background:
The SFC participates in various Open Source conference and often has a booth. If they have a booth they'd like to have Inkscape promotional items in the booth (stickers, etc.) to help promote Inkscape. This helps the project in getting name recognition and representation at conferences that we're otherwise not attending. Previously we've done approvals on a per-event basis, which has worked, but thinking it makes more sense to approve this as an open item so the SFC can manage their inventory as needed. Proposal: a. Approve up to $300 for the SFC to purchase Inkscape promotional items. b. Approve a different amount of: ________ c. Do not approve any budget for promotional items
Timeline: Opening: 2022-08-05 Closing: 2022-08-12
Ted
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participants (5)
-
C R -
Josh Andler -
Marc Jeanmougin -
Martin Owens -
Ted Gould