5 Jul
2018
5 Jul
'18
9:01 p.m.
Am 05.07.2018 um 22:32 schrieb Olof Bjarnason:
Well stated Xaviju!
The solution to "it's hard to change the design because it requires a rebuild/developer deep knowledge" is "do not require a rebuild".
So then, doesn't the following make sense?
- Focus dev efforts on making the inkscape source code less "hard coded"
and more "configurable"
- Consequence: allow designers to rethink/test and iterative new designs
without the burden of nagging devs to implement change in code
- It's already happening. It's not the main focus, though, currently, as there's a lot that needs focussing ;-)
For example, make the following aspects of the UI configurable through .json, .xml, .yaml or whatever fits:
- icon set to use
- toolbar content (tool sets)
- These are already configurable. Icon sets can be selected by the user for as long as I know Inkscape (it's just an svg file, or now, in master, a set of those). Toolbar content is configurable to some extent (one can remove tools, and change the order, basically) since Martin worked on it during one of the previous hackfests (these are configurable via XML-based files). That change is only available in the master/development branch.
- toolbar layout (toolbar positioning)
- Yep. Currently, there's just a limited set of choices for that.
- text looks (font choice, size, style etc) via "CSS similar syntax" (I
think this work is already underway, right Tav?)
- Isn't this a themeing thing, and would belong into the OS theme rather than in the application? This is already configurable via OS theme, and on Windows, I think it's even per-app configurable (gtkrc file). On Linux, I think that's possible, too, but I don't know how.
As far as I know, Tav is working on the text in the drawings you make with Inkscape, not on themeing.
- ... add more as the configuration "system" matures
- To begin with, it is enough if a restart of Inkscape is needed to see
changes.
- Then, having a "reload config" button in preferences or somewhere,
makes iteration quicker.
- With time, detecting modifications to the config files triggering a
refresh would make it very easy to modify UI on the fly, but hardly required to design things.
The current approach of "design task forces" will keep failing on it being so hard to implement the proposed design in the project, that no developer is willing to do it...
- Work has already begun on making Inkscape more configurable. I think it was the intention to allow designers (and anyone else) to use glade to design the interface.
For a truly configurable interface, however, there's a lot of infrastructure work to be done (this is what Alex has been working on, the conversion between the GAction(?) and GtkAction(?) commands, which allows to have dialog elements be separate from the command they trigger when uses.
Only then can developers start to work on making the dialogs configurable.
After that, it needs some documentation (or the designers need to document as they go).
Then, designers can start.
Disclaimer: I'm not a dev, but this is what I understood :)
Maren
My 2 cents. Have a great weekend and keep on pushing Inkscape forward!
On Thu, 5 Jul 2018 at 22:21, Xaviju Julián <xaviju@...400... mailto:xaviju@...400...> wrote:
Hi, There has been many attempts to design a better UX/UI with amazing theme proposals, that probably will never be implemented. This is a long time complaint of many inkscape users and I strongly agree that has to be improved. Said that, I think that the only way to accomplish this is to become an active community member, learn from the current team, understand the project and what can/can't be done and join forces to improve it in the future. Sometime just throwing designs (and I did it in the past) will be frustrating for both the designers and developers. Just saying, we need to be empathetic. :) UI will only improve if more designers join this team and join forces with current developers. On Thu, Jul 5, 2018 at 10:03 PM Victor Westmann <victor.westmann@...400... <mailto:victor.westmann@...400...>> wrote: Wow! Those icons are really awesome and look really good! Thanks for sharing. Do you know if we have access to the icon file that is proposed on this link? Or us it just a proposal of a new theme? Awesome work! Really impressive. On Thu, Jul 5, 2018, 12:54 PM Sebastian Zartner, <sebastianzartner@...400... <mailto:sebastianzartner@...400...>> wrote: Just want to mention that there were previous approaches to redesign the UI and the icons. See e.g. http://artntechasone.com/forInkscapeTeam.html. Sebastian On 1 July 2018 at 12:30, brynn <brynn@...3133... <mailto:brynn@...3133...>> wrote: Yes, please keep users involved in these changes. Personally, I don't have any problems with Inkscape icons or the interface -- in general -- although there are certainly some places which could be improved (especially the language used in the dialogs) (i.e. UX). If we do any survey, please let's put some thought into it, so the results are as useful as possible. I'm just a humble user, so can't offer any advice about designing or programming. Welcome to the community, Mare! (fyi, we also have a lovely woman named Maren who participates on both development and user sides. So we will have to be careful about spelling names :-) . I wouldn't be surprised if she chimes in shortly :-) ). All best, brynn -----Original Message----- From: Marién Soria Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2018 2:04 PM To: Victor Westmann Cc: Inkscape-Devel Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] New developer member Hi guys! It's Mare from a different email. Mare and Marién is the same person. Some one can tell me how many people are in the developer team? I trying to find the correct and free tool for share design ideas and get feedback about it. Do we have a twitter or facebook page? Maybe it will be nice make a survey to learn about our users. Like a user experience research. What do you think? El 14:18 Sáb Jun 30, 2018, Victor Westmann <victor.westmann@...400... <mailto:victor.westmann@...400...>> escribió: Hi Everyone, Just so I can start doing some tests... could you please help me understand a few things about the icons used in the toolbars inside Inkscape 0.92.3? What is the size I need to build the icons? (or tweak the existing ones?) 32x32 px? I am sorry if this is a silly question. And should all the icons be in the same file (just like icons.svg that was previously discussed in this thread) or should the icon files be stored in individual files? The format we need to use them is PNG or SVG? Thanks! --Victor Westmann On Fri, Jun 29, 2018 at 5:32 PM, Victor Westmann <victor.westmann@...400... <mailto:victor.westmann@...400...>> wrote: Hi All, How is everyone doing today? ;-) Indeed Martin! I just downloaded Tango Icons (form Mihaela's link ( https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape/blob/0.92.x.FixBug1777530/share/icons/tango_icons.svg )) and downloaded Symbolic icons from Jabier ( https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape/blob/0.92.x/share/icons/symbolic_icons.svg) and renamed them to "icons.svg" in %inkscape_dir%\share\icons\icons.svg and it did NOT work. Do you guys know what needs to be done for the icons to be replaced by either the "tango" or the "symbolic" icons? As soon as I know how to replace them I will start doing some testing... Thanks everyone for the assistance so far! --Victor Westmann On Fri, Jun 29, 2018 at 5:10 PM, <doctormo@...400... <mailto:doctormo@...400...>> wrote: Dear All! I believe Alex worked on making all the icons seperate files for the hackfest, those large icon pack svg files might not work in trunk any more. Although I think there's a script to unpack them. So either way, take care to maintain compatibility with the next version by using (or testing) with the trunk version itself. Best Regards, Martin Owens On Sat, 2018-06-30 at 01:33 +0200, Jabier Arraiza wrote: Is a mixed work for a lot of people, I think is generated with the suv work that also add some icons. I dont know. Now Im moving symboloc icons to devel folowing Tav work. Think soon are available. Regards, Jabier. On Fri, 2018-06-29 at 16:14 -0700, Victor Westmann wrote: > Hi Jabier, > > This is a really nice set. Do you know who built it? > > Do you know if we have a "catalog" of all the available icons we > can > use in Inkscape? > > So for now we have > > default icons > tango icons > symbolic icons > > Am I missing any other one? > If we know about all of them in the future this will be able to > become an option inside of the application ;-) > > Regards, > > > > > > --Victor Westmann > > On Fri, Jun 29, 2018 at 1:46 PM, Jabier Arraiza <jabier.arraiza@...3285... > ke > r.es <http://r.es>> wrote: > > We have done symbolic icons for inkscape. They are pretty cool. > > You can use in inkscape overwriting the icons.svg file thith the > > file > > in this link. > > > > https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape/blob/0.92.x/share/icons/symb > > ol > > ic_icons.svg > > With a svg ¿single? text search&replace you can tweak for dark ui > > the icons (more suitable to be white UI) > > > > Work for 0.92.x for PreAlpha1 (development) is don't done jet. > > > > Regards. > > > > > > On Fri, 2018-06-29 at 17:22 -0300, Mare Soria wrote: > > > "I would say that a good starting point for us is to gather > > > more > > > people that could potentially also want to help us redesign the > > > icons" > > > I think is a great idea, something like two icons for each > > > > designer, > > > for example. But for do that we need encourage the community. > > > We > > > > need > > > more interaction with our users. > > > > > > About the image you share with me: I'm trying to figure out > > > what > > > > are > > > you trying to show me. And that make me think about we need a > > > > good > > > tool to share designs ideas! > > > Please, explain me with words you idea. > > > I'll try to make a list of apps we can use for improve our > > > design > > > comunication. > > > > > > El vie., 29 de jun. de 2018 a la(s) 17:10, Victor Westmann > > > > (victor.we > > > stmann@...400... <mailto:stmann@...400...>) escribió: > > > > Hi Mare, > > > > > > > > amazing! > > > > > > > > I would say that a good starting point for us is to gather > > > > more > > > > people that could potentially also want to help us redesign > > > > the > > > > icons (maybe announce it somewhere?) and measure the efforts > > > > of > > > > this work first. > > > > I believe that the file that stores all (or at least most) of > > > > the > > > > icons that are used in the UI are stored in: > > > > %Inkscape_DIR%\inkscape\share\icons\icons.svg > > > > > > > > Depending on the architecture of the Inkscape you installed > > > > (32 > > > > or > > > > 64 bit) it should be in one of those two places: > > > > > > > > 32 bit >> C:\Program Files\inkscape\share\icons\icons.svg > > > > 64 bit >> C:\Program Files > > > > (x86)\inkscape\share\icons\icons.svg > > > > > > > > My initial idea is represented here https://ibb.co/gK6OxJ > > > > > > > > I have some drawing abilities but I am not a designer. > > > > > > > > Let me know what you think and how can I help! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --Victor Westmann > > > > > > > > On Fri, Jun 29, 2018 at 12:22 PM, Mare Soria <mare.soria@...3387... > > > > l. > > > > com> > > > > wrote: > > > > > I'm in my friend! > > > > > Yeap, the new Gimp style is lovely. > > > > > I had started to change the icons a time ago, but there are > > > > many! > > > > > I have personally choosen a minimalistic version and for do > > > > that > > > > > helps me the free icons of Material Design by > > > > > Google. https: > > > > //ma > > > > > terial.io/tools/icons/?style=baseline <http://terial.io/tools/icons/?style=baseline> > > > > > > > > > > I just start work around the new interface structure. You > > > > > can > > > > > contact me at any moment! > > > > > > > > > > El vie., 29 de jun. de 2018 a la(s) 15:59, Victor Westmann > > > > (victo > > > > > r.westmann@...400... <mailto:r.westmann@...400...>) escribió: > > > > > > Hi Mare Soria, > > > > > > > > > > > > Welcome! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I feel exactly the same. This project is extremely > > > > > > useful > > > > and > > > > > > powerful but the UI makes it look old. I was wondering if > > > > we > > > > > > could join forces to propose a new design of the icons on > > > > the > > > > > > project and maybe even create a small new project > > > > > > instead. > > > > > > > > > > > > I was just wondering if we could gather graphic > > > > > > designers, > > > > > > icon makers and people of the same nature to design a > > > > > > dark > > > > ui > > > > > > theme for inkscape on Windows and Mac OS platforms > > > > > > (because > > > > I > > > > > > Know this was already done in Linux). And we could > > > > > > redesign > > > > all > > > > > > of the icons. Just like Gimp did. The new UI gimp has is > > > > super > > > > > > pretty, modern, and doesn’t fatigue our eyes (because of > > > > the > > > > > > dark theme and colors). https://www.gimp.org/release-not > > > > > > es > > > > /gim > > > > > > p-2.10.html > > > > > > > > > > > > This would also address the new monitor resolutions that > > > > > > people will use inkscape (4K or really big resolutions). > > > > > > > > > > > > What do you say? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --Victor Westmann > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > ---- > > > ----------- > > > Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most > > > engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Inkscape-devel mailing list > > > Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net <mailto:Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net> > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel ------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------- Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net <mailto:Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net <mailto:Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net <mailto:Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net <mailto:Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net <mailto:Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net <mailto:Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net <mailto:Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
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