> On Nov 18, 2019, at 2:58 PM, C R <cajhne@gmail.com> wrote:
> No document window open and just a bar at the top? That's just awful UX imho.
> Terrible UX. Fight me. lol
You are I are entitled to opinions about whether or not it's a good UX, but that *is* the standard of how Mac applications have worked since 1984.
Yes, and because its old does not mean that is good. It roundly violates Apple's own current UX documents. But whatever. I see this is a sore spot, so I'll leave it alone.
Putting that on Ben, or me, is not appropriate. (Asking for a fight, even jokingly, even less so.)
One of the perils of talking with me is the occasional joke. I'm not discussing anything with Ben at this point. To be clear, I only discuss when the conversation is friendly and constructive. If it's not, I'll have a bit of a laugh and move on to more satisfying activities (with Inkscape there is always so much to do).
> Also, I don't get the attitude "you're all just lazy" and then refusing to fill out a bug report so we can action it.
I don't like it either, but I think that I do understand where it's coming from. We, the Inkscape community, have a bad habit of telling users to report or contribute something one way, and then when they do exactly as we've asked, we ask them to do it a different way.*
That's why I said we should fix it if that's the case. It's a bug to tell the users to just report a laundry list to the dev mailing list. Frustrating for everyone. It's not a "habit" it's a bug. There is less fixing possible with language like "lazy and arrogant". I'm not giving anyone a pass on that. I don't care how mildly annoyed they are, there's no good reason for it. ;)
That exact same thing has happened to me several times, and it can be *extremely* frustrating, especially for someone new in a community. People lash out when they're frustrated.
We are volunteers trying our best to help. Don't lash out at us. It's demotivating and frustrating when everyone - every single one of us works so hard to improve Inkscape. It wins no friends, adds no features, and loses credibility of the person in the community. If we need to spell that out better in our documentation, I'm all for it.
Done! :)
Now-- For everyone's sake: Let's please move any further discussion of this particular UX issue _there_ and off this mailing list.
*I'm totally up for discussions about how to be genuinely more welcoming to new contributors.
I agree. All new UX discussion there now that it exists.
Re: New contributors - I don't want people to think it's okay to call our developers names, or fling irrational criticism at all the hard work that has already gone into Inkscape. It's really not okay. Doc made that clear enough though so I'll just refer to the wisdom he offered earlier in the thread.
My 2p.
-C