On Thu, Sep 07, 2017 at 08:37:30AM +0100, C R wrote:
Just wanted to say, I don't think anyone was suggesting that Patreon is the optimal long-term solution for the project. It just seems like something that could get us by for now and address the needs of some of our current (long term) developers. Most of this you can blame me for, it was my idea to use Patreon in the short term while the project decides if it wants to support full-time developers. It was me who offered it as a solution for our contributing students who will need to enter the job market soon, and could be working on Inkscape full-time instead of searching for a job (or two) to make ends meet. It's something we discussed at length at the hackfest.
Aha, thank you CR very much for the explanation. Indeed, it was my misinterpretation that the objective was a long-term solution, not merely as a short-term workaround. So I evidently missed a chunk of context. If I'd been there, I could have helped steer that discussion to something implementable and avoid getting stuck in a dead end, and I'm very sorry I didn't make it. Martin is exactly right that syncing ourselves up would be far easier in face to face communication.
What's great is that we all share the same ultimate goal here - making the Inkscape software as good as it can be. And, secondarily, those of us following these discussion threads also recognize the immense value that donors can and are bringing to our project, and share the same interest in using their contributions to solve problems that face our software, community, and developers.
I mentioned earlier, that this is a topic I've been passionate about for quite some time. So seeing ideas being proposed is wonderful, and it's enthusiastic to see others getting interested and finding passion in this space. We may find ourselves starting on different pages, but at least we're in the same book!
As they say, you have to crawl before you walk, and walk before you run. Unfortunately, we're very far from being able to manage a payroll, both financially and managerially. Personally I think from a management standpoint we're at a point we might be able to handle some limited contract work (on the scale of GSoC, maybe with a few tweaks and enhancements), but if we do, we need to tie it very tightly to donors and their desires so we don't disappoint them, but instead strengthen their interest in continuing their support of us. Financially, our income is healthy but irregular; I don't feel it is steady enough to depend on longer term, and think we need to do a lot more to strengthen it before we can think of it that way.
So if you raised some expectations with students wishing for reliable employment opportunities, it's a bit of a shame - that's something that would be great if we could do, but honestly it's far beyond our abilities to commit to right now. I would hate to put them in a position of dependency on us, when there's a large risk we'd let them down.
If we did have the means to start paying for full-time work, it's not at all clear that we'd want to fund entry-level workers. Inkscape might benefit more from hiring for experience. It might even make sense not to hire a core developer, but someone to work on non-core areas that need desperately but fail to find any volunteers.
Anyway, again, thank you C R for identifying where this got offtrack, and explaining the larger context. I'm glad we're all of similar mind on the main goals, we just need to work harder to get on the same page.
I will have to humbly admit here, that while I have done a fair amount of thinking in this area, I've been horribly untransparent at sharing my personal findings and conclusions. I'm sure that has only served to further disconnect our collective understanding, and I'm very sorry about that. Having only me convinced of something doesn't help us as a group, and ultimately it's all of us that matter, not me.
Bryce