Hi,
I didn't catch up when you were discussing details of i18n implementation for our beloved www.inkscape.org.
All I want is to point out that web-sites can be translated via gettext just like applications. Example is http://audacity.sf.net, where you just download a .pot file (from http://audacity.sourceforge.net/community/translation), translate it in KBabel, poEdit, GTranslator or whatever else and commit it to CVS or send to one of developers.
When anything at ("on" is the right preposition?) the site updates, .pot files updates as well (currently manually, but this could be done automatically, I think). Translators then only need to merge changes tro translations and send them back to developer or commit themselves. This is quite handy.
I don't know details of implementation, but I think that Matt Brubeck, who is in charge for that site, could help you. His e-mail address is mbrubeck =at= cs.hmc.edu
Alexandre
On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 01:07:34AM +0400, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote:
All I want is to point out that web-sites can be translated via gettext just like applications. Example is http://audacity.sf.net, where you just download a .pot file (from http://audacity.sourceforge.net/community/translation), translate it in KBabel, poEdit, GTranslator or whatever else and commit it to CVS or send to one of developers.
Pretty cool. Looks like it's all done with PHP.
I'm a fan of static files, since we're frequently hammered when new releases come out, etc.
As far as "out of date" translations, I think we can avoid it by having a rule that says, "any translation more than 14 days behind the main site should be disabled", and "any translation not updated by release time should be disabled". This will make sure we've always got either a recent translation, or none, forcing a fall-back to the main site.
Thoughts?
I'm a fan of static files, since we're frequently hammered when new releases come out, etc.
Well, i belive that PHP does not use as much resources as you think... We could also: - disable the random screenshot on new releases (takes some time to load) - make the front-site static on releases (but i dont think this helps a lot)
but anyway, the big traffic might be the downloads...!?! try to move all the builds to other servers on the next release... this might give a less homeopathic effect than switching to static pages...
As far as "out of date" translations, I think we can avoid it by having a rule that says, "any translation more than 14 days behind the main site should be disabled", and "any translation not updated by release time should be disabled". This will make sure we've always got either a recent translation, or none, forcing a fall-back to the main site.
Thoughts?
yes. try my new mockup: http://www.inkscape.org/index2.php
It will switch to your preferred language automatically, but you may override that by clicking the flags the news are in single files like news/de/2005/09/003.inc if a news hasnt been translated, the english one is shown automatically. also, it always shows the news of the current and the past month. no extra work needed to update that. and layout/content is fully separated. like announced in my last mail. i plan to do it similar to other pages like sceenshots, so the message will be in your language if available, english if not.
i hope, you all like this mockup, so i didn't do all this for nothing ;) (yeah, took a while...)
if that would be okay, i'd switch the site to that.
greets, Caliga
On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 07:45:38PM +0200, Daniel Stiefelmaier wrote:
yes. try my new mockup: http://www.inkscape.org/index2.php
It will switch to your preferred language automatically, but you may override that by clicking the flags the news are in single files like news/de/2005/09/003.inc
This has my vote. :)
Daniel Stiefelmaier <mail@...985...> writes:
It will switch to your preferred language automatically, but you may override that by clicking the flags
By the way, here is a thread about Gnome's "No flags" policy:
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2003-November/msg00267.htm...
Cheers, Colin
On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 09:20:45PM +0200, Colin Marquardt wrote:
Daniel Stiefelmaier <mail@...985...> writes:
It will switch to your preferred language automatically, but you may override that by clicking the flags
By the way, here is a thread about Gnome's "No flags" policy:
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2003-November/msg00267.htm...
Inkscape isn't a Gnome project so this doesn't apply to us. Besides, that policy is for software distribution, not for websites. And in any case it would be silly to let a tiff between two flags spoil their use in general. ;-)
Bryce
Bryce Harrington <bryce@...260...> writes:
On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 09:20:45PM +0200, Colin Marquardt wrote:
By the way, here is a thread about Gnome's "No flags" policy:
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2003-November/msg00267.htm...
Inkscape isn't a Gnome project so this doesn't apply to us.
Oh, I wasn't trying to imply that, I was just pointing out that there are reasons that cause a big project to not relate flags to languages.
Cheers, Colin
On Fri, Sep 16, 2005 at 12:25:38AM +0200, Colin Marquardt wrote:
Bryce Harrington <bryce@...260...> writes:
On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 09:20:45PM +0200, Colin Marquardt wrote:
By the way, here is a thread about Gnome's "No flags" policy:
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2003-November/msg00267.htm...
Inkscape isn't a Gnome project so this doesn't apply to us.
Oh, I wasn't trying to imply that, I was just pointing out that there are reasons that cause a big project to not relate flags to languages.
We've had experience with these issues directly via the Open Clipart Library, that collects and distributes flags created in Inkscape and other SVG programs. So we're aware of the issues but simply choose to take a different approach.
Bryce
Bryce Harrington wrote:
On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 09:20:45PM +0200, Colin Marquardt wrote:
Daniel Stiefelmaier <mail@...985...> writes:
It will switch to your preferred language automatically, but you may override that by clicking the flags
By the way, here is a thread about Gnome's "No flags" policy:
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2003-November/msg00267.htm...
I alwways thought that free software was free like 'free as free speech' not like 'free as in china'. Gnome policy about flags is the beginning of the end for freedom. (that is to say, stopping to speech - not distributing flags - to obey some orders). Today, that just talks about a flag, tomorrow that will be some screensavers or background screen discarded , the day after tomorrow that will may be a software that prevent to post some news on special sites or specially include a patch that prevents to write some words in a word processor.
All that is not free software, gpl or not. free software is not free as free beer.
Hervé
herve couvelard wrote:
On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 09:20:45PM +0200, Colin Marquardt wrote:
By the way, here is a thread about Gnome's "No flags" policy:
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2003-November/msg00267.htm...
I alwways thought that free software was free like 'free as free speech' not like 'free as in china'. Gnome policy about flags is the beginning of the end for freedom. (that is to say, stopping to speech - not distributing flags - to obey some orders). Today, that just talks about a flag, tomorrow that will be some screensavers or background screen discarded , the day after tomorrow that will may be a software that prevent to post some news on special sites or specially include a patch that prevents to write some words in a word processor.
This "no flags" policy is wider than GNOME. For example at OpenOffice.org is *forbidden* the use of any flags, even inside native language/local subprojects.
Personally, I disagree with this, but the only way to put a flag on the subproject where I'm one of the maintainers was to disguise it: http://ro.openoffice.org/gfx/logo_ro.png
I alwways thought that free software was free like 'free as free speech' not like 'free as in china'. Gnome policy about flags is the beginning of the end for freedom. (that is to say, stopping to speech - not distributing flags - to obey some orders). Today, that just talks about a flag, tomorrow that will be some screensavers or background screen discarded , the day after tomorrow that will may be a software that prevent to post some news on special sites or specially include a patch that prevents to write some words in a word processor.
This "no flags" policy is wider than GNOME. For example at OpenOffice.org is *forbidden* the use of any flags, even inside native language/local subprojects.
Personally, I disagree with this, but the only way to put a flag on the subproject where I'm one of the maintainers was to disguise it: http://ro.openoffice.org/gfx/logo_ro.png
-- nicu
I could understand in example that spain is not the only spanish speaking country.
Spanish, English and french are more used out of Spain, England, and France than in. The people out of this countries have the right to complain, but the use of flag icons is very fast to understand. If anybody has better alternatives please tell us.
Personally,I don't want to fall into surrender the truth because of some people desires. Taiwan is an independent country occupied by chinesse people that didn't wanted to be communist. What Chinese government want is to extend its great Firewall over all of us, trying to control what we think and do. As Herve said it's only a start, as they are a lot of people that want to control us.
Jose Hevia
On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 07:45:38PM +0200, Daniel Stiefelmaier wrote:
I'm a fan of static files, since we're frequently hammered when new releases come out, etc.
Well, i belive that PHP does not use as much resources as you think... We could also:
- disable the random screenshot on new releases (takes some time to load)
Fwiw, I suspect the random screenshot could be done using javascript.
- make the front-site static on releases (but i dont think this helps a lot)
but anyway, the big traffic might be the downloads...!?! try to move all the builds to other servers on the next release... this might give a less homeopathic effect than switching to static pages...
Actually, the downloads are already moved off onto mirrors.
Bryce
participants (8)
-
Alexandre Prokoudine -
Bryce Harrington -
Colin Marquardt -
Daniel Stiefelmaier -
herve couvelard -
Jose Hevia -
Kees Cook -
Nicu Buculei