Dear Inkscape,
These are the results from todays user testing at SpinachCon 2016 here in Boston:
* Selecting objects is hard when there are transparent areas * Double clicking often hit mistakenly * Tools for text are hard to find compared to other tools (no context when text and path selected for example) * Text did not indicate it's text alignment when changed (user was confused) * Tried to drag the text node (which indicates the text alignment) * Colour wheel was hard to use (dragging attempted) * Completing an object (the final node) was difficult in 80% of cases creating false endings in most cases. * Clicking wrong option in text menu resulted in text disappearing (Fit in box, rather than put on path)
No LPEs or other advanced features tested
New items: * New rendering order UI: all users used icons to select the requested rendering order quickly. Line cap and corner style uneffected. * Fixed unit text line height was still a bit buggy, but worked ok. Units reverted to pixels which confused users.
I've formatted the items for ease of reading.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Great stuff Martin!
I recognise the pain of closing a path properly. Why isn't there a keyboard shortcut to do that...?
Mvh
/Olof ----------------- 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 18 March 2016 at 22:18, Martin Owens <doctormo@...400...> wrote:
Dear Inkscape,
These are the results from todays user testing at SpinachCon 2016 here in Boston:
- Selecting objects is hard when there are transparent areas
- Double clicking often hit mistakenly
- Tools for text are hard to find compared to other tools (no context
when text and path selected for example)
- Text did not indicate it's text alignment when changed (user was
confused)
- Tried to drag the text node (which indicates the text alignment)
- Colour wheel was hard to use (dragging attempted)
- Completing an object (the final node) was difficult in 80% of cases
creating false endings in most cases.
- Clicking wrong option in text menu resulted in text disappearing (Fit
in box, rather than put on path)
No LPEs or other advanced features tested
New items:
- New rendering order UI: all users used icons to select the requested
rendering order quickly. Line cap and corner style uneffected.
- Fixed unit text line height was still a bit buggy, but worked ok.
Units reverted to pixels which confused users.
I've formatted the items for ease of reading.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Very interesting ! About text tool for example if you begin to type a text and go to change something like the font in the control bar you should be able to keep typing text without clicking again inside the text line. Instead of that if you try to type any letter immediately after your change in the control bar Inkscape switches between tools and this is a pain ! ivan
Le Vendredi 18 mars 2016 22h33, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...1063....> a écrit :
Great stuff Martin! I recognise the pain of closing a path properly. Why isn't there a keyboard shortcut to do that...?
Mvh
/Olof-----------------3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android.https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 18 March 2016 at 22:18, Martin Owens <doctormo@...400...> wrote:
Dear Inkscape,
These are the results from todays user testing at SpinachCon 2016 here in Boston:
* Selecting objects is hard when there are transparent areas * Double clicking often hit mistakenly * Tools for text are hard to find compared to other tools (no context when text and path selected for example) * Text did not indicate it's text alignment when changed (user was confused) * Tried to drag the text node (which indicates the text alignment) * Colour wheel was hard to use (dragging attempted) * Completing an object (the final node) was difficult in 80% of cases creating false endings in most cases. * Clicking wrong option in text menu resulted in text disappearing (Fit in box, rather than put on path)
No LPEs or other advanced features tested
New items: * New rendering order UI: all users used icons to select the requested rendering order quickly. Line cap and corner style uneffected. * Fixed unit text line height was still a bit buggy, but worked ok. Units reverted to pixels which confused users.
I've formatted the items for ease of reading.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
We all share this pain... I have proposed a few times on irc, even got a few nods for that proposition, that ctrl+enter key combo closes the path. The only problem I could see is perpendicular path drawing mode, which I think should add one more node if we don't want to surprise user with sudden appearance of non 90degrees angle.
Vlada
On Fri, Mar 18, 2016, 22:34 Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
Great stuff Martin!
I recognise the pain of closing a path properly. Why isn't there a keyboard shortcut to do that...?
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 18 March 2016 at 22:18, Martin Owens <doctormo@...400...> wrote:
Dear Inkscape,
These are the results from todays user testing at SpinachCon 2016 here in Boston:
- Selecting objects is hard when there are transparent areas
- Double clicking often hit mistakenly
- Tools for text are hard to find compared to other tools (no context
when text and path selected for example)
- Text did not indicate it's text alignment when changed (user was
confused)
- Tried to drag the text node (which indicates the text alignment)
- Colour wheel was hard to use (dragging attempted)
- Completing an object (the final node) was difficult in 80% of cases
creating false endings in most cases.
- Clicking wrong option in text menu resulted in text disappearing (Fit
in box, rather than put on path)
No LPEs or other advanced features tested
New items:
- New rendering order UI: all users used icons to select the requested
rendering order quickly. Line cap and corner style uneffected.
- Fixed unit text line height was still a bit buggy, but worked ok.
Units reverted to pixels which confused users.
I've formatted the items for ease of reading.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Mvh
/Olof ----------------- 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 18 March 2016 at 22:32, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
Great stuff Martin!
I recognise the pain of closing a path properly. Why isn't there a keyboard shortcut to do that...?
I investigated this a little further; <Enter> finishes the path (with an open end segment).
Wouldn't <Shift-Enter> make sense to finish the path witha closed end segment?
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 18 March 2016 at 22:18, Martin Owens <doctormo@...400...> wrote:
Dear Inkscape,
These are the results from todays user testing at SpinachCon 2016 here in Boston:
- Selecting objects is hard when there are transparent areas
- Double clicking often hit mistakenly
- Tools for text are hard to find compared to other tools (no context
when text and path selected for example)
- Text did not indicate it's text alignment when changed (user was
confused)
- Tried to drag the text node (which indicates the text alignment)
- Colour wheel was hard to use (dragging attempted)
- Completing an object (the final node) was difficult in 80% of cases
creating false endings in most cases.
- Clicking wrong option in text menu resulted in text disappearing (Fit
in box, rather than put on path)
No LPEs or other advanced features tested
New items:
- New rendering order UI: all users used icons to select the requested
rendering order quickly. Line cap and corner style uneffected.
- Fixed unit text line height was still a bit buggy, but worked ok.
Units reverted to pixels which confused users.
I've formatted the items for ease of reading.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
On Fri, 2016-03-18 at 22:32 +0100, Olof Bjarnason wrote:
I recognise the pain of closing a path properly. Why isn't there a keyboard shortcut to do that...?
A keyboard shortcut would be good, but it wouldn't aid in this case.
I think perhaps a few things should happen:
1. There should be a snapping option for the end-node and it should be on by default. (I think snapping doesn't effect the pen tool?) 2. There should be more feedback with the graphics of the node, making it twice as big for instance instead of just changing the colour slightly when completion is likely to happen. 3. Shift+Enter to complete the path shortcut key.
We could also adjust the perpendicular lines option to be more friendly since that finishing node causes issues and forces a line which isn't strait.
Martin,
On Sat, Mar 19, 2016 at 5:34 AM, Martin Owens <doctormo@...400...> wrote:
- There should be a snapping option for the end-node and it should be
on by default. (I think snapping doesn't effect the pen tool?)
I think if 2 is implemented, it makes more sense to not implement this if the confusion appears to be significantly reduced. Snapping does work with the pen tool already.
- There should be more feedback with the graphics of the node, making
it twice as big for instance instead of just changing the colour slightly when completion is likely to happen.
Sounds like a better visual indicator.
- Shift+Enter to complete the path shortcut key.
Same shortcut I had in my mind, so your idea is brilliant imho. :)
Cheers, Josh
On 20 March 2016 at 04:37, Martin Owens <doctormo@...400...> wrote:
Same shortcut I had in my mind, so your idea is brilliant imho. :)
I've added the shortcut (Shift+Enter) and a bigger node on mouseover. Please review functionality and code commit (esp since Shift+Enter needed more code than expected)
Initial testing done -- wow such an improvement!
Some observations:
1. There is no status bar documentation of the Shift+Enter to close path behaviour 2. It's quite easy to create 1 node path, which is selectable, but cannot change stroke width or size of it. I think it might be what gives this console error too: ** (inkscape:11059): CRITICAL **: void Inkscape::UI::Tools::spdc_attach_selection(Inkscape::UI::Tools::FreehandBase*, Inkscape::Selection*): assertion 'c->get_segment_count() > 0' failed
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Sun, 2016-03-20 at 13:52 +0100, Jabiertxo Arraiza Cenoz wrote:
Geom::Point event_dt(desktop->w2d(event_w));
Gone now.
On Sun, 2016-03-20 at 09:09 +0100, Olof Bjarnason wrote:
- There is no status bar documentation of the Shift+Enter to close
path behaviour
Fixed.
- It's quite easy to create 1 node path, which is selectable, but
cannot change stroke width or size of it. I think it might be what gives this console error too: ** (inkscape:11059): CRITICAL **: void Inkscape::UI::Tools::spdc_attach_selection(Inkscape::UI::Tools::FreehandBase*, Inkscape::Selection*): assertion 'c->get_segment_count() > 0' failed
That's an historical bug and I'm not sure about it to be honest. I'm personally in favour of single node paths, but I know others disagree. In any case your works disappears; a fix would require understand exactly what npoints is, what green_line and red_line is and what one should expect to test in them.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Cool will retest tonight then.
Maybe the single node findings could be documented on the bug report? On 20 Mar 2016 14:17, "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...400...> wrote:
On Sun, 2016-03-20 at 13:52 +0100, Jabiertxo Arraiza Cenoz wrote:
Geom::Point event_dt(desktop->w2d(event_w));
Gone now.
On Sun, 2016-03-20 at 09:09 +0100, Olof Bjarnason wrote:
- There is no status bar documentation of the Shift+Enter to close
path behaviour
Fixed.
- It's quite easy to create 1 node path, which is selectable, but
cannot change stroke width or size of it. I think it might be what gives this console error too: ** (inkscape:11059): CRITICAL **: void
Inkscape::UI::Tools::spdc_attach_selection(Inkscape::UI::Tools::FreehandBase*, Inkscape::Selection*): assertion 'c->get_segment_count() > 0' failed
That's an historical bug and I'm not sure about it to be honest. I'm personally in favour of single node paths, but I know others disagree. In any case your works disappears; a fix would require understand exactly what npoints is, what green_line and red_line is and what one should expect to test in them.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On 20 March 2016 at 14:17, Martin Owens <doctormo@...400...> wrote:
On Sun, 2016-03-20 at 13:52 +0100, Jabiertxo Arraiza Cenoz wrote:
Geom::Point event_dt(desktop->w2d(event_w));
Gone now.
On Sun, 2016-03-20 at 09:09 +0100, Olof Bjarnason wrote:
- There is no status bar documentation of the Shift+Enter to close
path behaviour
Fixed.
Nice, I was going to nit-pick about it not being explanatory enough (it just says "Enter och Shift+Enter to finish the path"), however I think it's enough as the user will learn by trying that (and even more text will be hard on small resolutions).
- It's quite easy to create 1 node path, which is selectable, but
cannot change stroke width or size of it. I think it might be what gives this console error too: ** (inkscape:11059): CRITICAL **: void
Inkscape::UI::Tools::spdc_attach_selection(Inkscape::UI::Tools::FreehandBase*, Inkscape::Selection*): assertion 'c->get_segment_count() > 0' failed
That's an historical bug and I'm not sure about it to be honest. I'm personally in favour of single node paths, but I know others disagree. In any case your works disappears; a fix would require understand exactly what npoints is, what green_line and red_line is and what one should expect to test in them.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Cool! One question for whath is this line:
Geom::Point event_dt(desktop->w2d(event_w));
Not used in the diff in any place.
Cheers, Jabier.
El sáb, 19-03-2016 a las 23:37 -0400, Martin Owens escribió:
Same shortcut I had in my mind, so your idea is brilliant imho. :)
I've added the shortcut (Shift+Enter) and a bigger node on mouseover. Please review functionality and code commit (esp since Shift+Enter needed more code than expected)
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Thanks Martin for try!
Not sure why but from mounts ago to this part the weel color selection is changed and now is too much hard to use than previous, maybe is a bug?
Cheers, Jabier.
El vie, 18-03-2016 a las 17:18 -0400, Martin Owens escribió:
Dear Inkscape,
These are the results from todays user testing at SpinachCon 2016 here in Boston:
* Selecting objects is hard when there are transparent areas * Double clicking often hit mistakenly * Tools for text are hard to find compared to other tools (no context when text and path selected for example) * Text did not indicate it's text alignment when changed (user was confused) * Tried to drag the text node (which indicates the text alignment) * Colour wheel was hard to use (dragging attempted) * Completing an object (the final node) was difficult in 80% of cases creating false endings in most cases. * Clicking wrong option in text menu resulted in text disappearing (Fit in box, rather than put on path) No LPEs or other advanced features tested New items: * New rendering order UI: all users used icons to select the requested rendering order quickly. Line cap and corner style uneffected. * Fixed unit text line height was still a bit buggy, but worked ok. Units reverted to pixels which confused users.
I've formatted the items for ease of reading.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Interesting!
Could you clarify some of those? (Not that I could help to fix of course, but I'm just interested :-))
- Double clicking often hit mistakenly
(double-clicking by mistake would seem to be "user error" - so it must mean something else?) (Oh, this must be when you click the 2nd time with Selection tool too quickly, and it switches to the Node tool or enters the group? Yes, that was quite annoying when I first started with Inkscape - still does, sometimes.)
- Colour wheel was hard to use (dragging attempted)
(I had the same experience when I first saw that kind of wheel (which was probably in GIMP). Maybe HSL tab should be the default?)
- Completing an object (the final node) was difficult in 80% of cases
creating false endings in most cases.
(Not sure if that means for attempting to close a path. But that little box is indeed Tiny!)
- Clicking wrong option in text menu resulted in text disappearing (Fit
in box, rather than put on path)
(In general, there are many times when clicking the wrong thing makes objects disappear - not just text.)
New items:
- New rendering order UI: all users used icons to select the requested
rendering order quickly. Line cap and corner style uneffected.
(What is rendering order?)
brynn
-------------------------------------------------- From: "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...400...> Sent: Friday, March 18, 2016 3:18 PM To: "inkscape-devel" inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: [Inkscape-devel] SpinachCon Results
Dear Inkscape,
These are the results from todays user testing at SpinachCon 2016 here in Boston:
- Selecting objects is hard when there are transparent areas
- Double clicking often hit mistakenly
- Tools for text are hard to find compared to other tools (no context
when text and path selected for example)
- Text did not indicate it's text alignment when changed (user was
confused)
- Tried to drag the text node (which indicates the text alignment)
- Colour wheel was hard to use (dragging attempted)
- Completing an object (the final node) was difficult in 80% of cases
creating false endings in most cases.
- Clicking wrong option in text menu resulted in text disappearing (Fit
in box, rather than put on path)
No LPEs or other advanced features tested
New items:
- New rendering order UI: all users used icons to select the requested
rendering order quickly. Line cap and corner style uneffected.
- Fixed unit text line height was still a bit buggy, but worked ok.
Units reverted to pixels which confused users.
I've formatted the items for ease of reading.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
participants (7)
-
Brynn -
Ivan Louette -
Jabiertxo Arraiza Cenoz -
Josh Andler -
Martin Owens -
Olof Bjarnason -
Vladimir Savic