Joel Holdsworth wrote:
This discussion doesn't seem to be going well for the Tango
seems like a great shame to me because I strongly prefer them. I think they
with the HIG, are the best thing to happen to the free desktop for a long
time - I mean the quite seriously.
Things aren't NOT going well for the Tango icons... you're just not
seeing the overwhelming support you hoped for. To a few of us, the
proposed tango icons are insufficient (and fairly incomplete) in their
current incarnation. No one said "NO! NEVER!!". :)
Also, all HIGs have drawbacks... there is no silver bullet. After all,
the Gnome guys think that the screensavers should no longer have
options/be configurable... because it might confuse users.
A huge part of this is that this whole thing is very opinion and
preference driven. It doesn't seem like it's being taken into
consideration that all of the icons in inkscape need to be consistent,
not only the tool icons (and those are really all I'm seeing at this point).
- I think they look slicker - more highly designed.
And I think the current set is slicker and more highly designed... in
fact it was specifically designed for inkscape from the ground up.
- The colours look more vibrant - I can't stand the "pastel
shades" of the
present set, they look washed out and anemic to me.
Are we looking at the same icons? Given that all the shape tools of the
tango set lack color, this view seems backwards to me. The Tango icons
are pretty bland and boring imho.
- The Tango Icons look a lot better for Windows users, and I'd
as well for Ubuntu-default-install users, because the icons look very much
more in keeping with the parent desktop.
One of the first things I do on a fresh Ubuntu install is change the
icons and theme. It's pretty plain and boring by default. Additionally,
no userbase takes precedence... just because it's better for the Windows
folk doesn't mean the rest of us should have to suffer through it. ;)
- Also, am I right in thinking that the GTK guys are moving their
over to Tango for New, Save, Print etc. in the near future? I hope so,
because the present ones look terrible in the Windows version - but funnily
enough they look consistent with the rest of the Inkscape set. So as we
upgrade GTK, parts of Inkscape will become more Tango-ey (IMHO better
looking) while other parts will retain the same old look - rather the way
Windows 95 did when all those 16-bit apps became obselete.
Using platform specific New, Open, Save, etc is the way this is handled.
Again, so no setup takes precedence over the others.
- For me attention to detail REALLY matters. I believe it's worth
time to get the little things right. But also, these icons are not such a
tiny detail, because for many users they are thing that carry the feel of
the app to a first time user. Even for long time users, a good working
environment can make the user feel subtly happier about their work as they
I'm pretty sure attention to detail really matters to all of us that
have participated in this conversation. A key thing I haven't seen
though is people offering said time to not only get the changes made,
but to spend a lot of additional time getting things right (for
inkscape). I see people saying they want the change, but I haven't seen
people offering their time (and additional tweak time) to get things to
a place that everyone will be happy with. As I've stated, I'll
personally be frustrated to see it affecting programmers time (unless
they choose)... and in the past that's exactly what happened.
- GIMP-Win's makover is a radical improvement for me. I
couldn't stand to
use it before; it was so ugly in Windows. Now I quite like to use it - wierd
window structure asside.
Wait. Are you SERIOUSLY trying to tell me that you didn't (or couldn't
stand to) use an app that got the job done... because of the icons?!?!
- Giving Inkscape a face lift will propel it further forward when
out, because people can immediately see new things from the very first
glance. This creates more buzz, which means more users, which means more
developers, which means better Inkscape.
If people REALLY want to see inkscape get a face lift for 0.46 (which a
number of us don't feel this is necessary), they'd better get crackin'.
No offense, but, less talk about it and more action. Given that I don't
like the Tango icons in the least... I for one won't be participating.
So all in all I really think it's worth one our 106 developers
time on this.
Some of those people are translators, many inactive for a few years,
etc. Either way, as Inkscape development has always gone... people work
on what they want to. If someone is really interested, they'll work on it.