It's inaccurate and unfair to characterize current inkscapeforum.com forum members as resentful, just because they are reluctant to move to a new, unproven forum. Although, they might easily become resentful if they are whitewashed as malcontents for just being cautious. 

Comments above in this discussion indicate that a phpbb forum is a viable fallback... why not *start* with a working, familiar, platform that has experienced worldwide users/moderators/developers? (A separate login from inkscape.org has not been a problem at the inkscapeforum.com forum, so it is a weak argument to say it is a significant obstacle for a new forum.)  If the project installed a phpbb forum structured in the same manner & functionality as the current inkscapeforum.com, most active members would be amenable to moving.  I certainly would. (Additional benefit would be the seamless integration of the old forum content, in the unlikely event the databases are provided.)  I don't see the overarching need to reinvent the wheel.

Current active users are vital to the success of a new forum. They attract new members by providing substantive contributions. Case in point, last year there were over 1700 users on the inkscapeforum.com in a *single day*... that's about as many users as inkscapecommunity.com has registered in *five years*.  I'm not saying the information at inkscapecommunity.com is inferior, but rather imagine if it had attracted more of the active group of users from inkscapeforum.com.  As an active contributor of inkscapeforum.com, I can attest to >2200 posts, local folders reflecting assistance to >600 unique users,  dropbox folders containing uploads of gif, svg, screenshots, for about 300 unique users... And I'm a relative lightweight compared to some other active users. 

The active users are participating at high levels for the love of Inkscape and its users. These are the anchors of the user community that attract and support new users. It might be wise to listen to what they have to say... not just in their comments, but in their reluctance to move away from what is currently working. 

TL;DR
Don't brand us as resentful just because we are comfortable staying with a working platform. It's not resentment keeping active users at the old forum, it's functionality. When the new forum works as well or better than the current forum, active users like myself will be more open to moving. 

Have a nice day.
TD

On Thu, Jan 31, 2019 at 5:21 AM alvinpenner <penner@...2467...> wrote:
okay, thanks, that is good to know.

Alvin




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Hi Martin,
        They didn't say it was closed.  They just said it wasn't ready yet, and 
that there was more work to be done.  And that InkscapeForum was to be left open 
indefinitely.  To me, that's back to limbo.  There was no mention of management.

> On the subject of development: It's not still in development, slowed or
stopped. It's waiting for management. Think of me as a resource to be
used to help get this project off the ground, not as a manager who is
driving it.

        Well, there are still some features, at least some that I requested, 
still not there yet.  And I think there are some others too, that you haven't 
finished.  Right?  I know you said you had a personal list you were working 
from, at one time.  But it still might be nice to have that list public (or did 
I just not find it yet?).

        But it will never go anywhere as long as the old forum stays open. 
Believe me, I've lived that scenario for the last 5 years!  Certainly not if we 
don't do any advertising or outreach about it.  Plus, if the new one is open, 
and all the others are still open, I can tell you that I, for one, will not be 
visiting 4 forums every day.  (I manage 2 myself - everyone else would have to 
visit 3 forums every day.)

        Now, if we're going to have an official opening for the new forum, and 
do some outreach and advertising, (and put it in the main menu of the website), 
I'll be glad to reorganize and divert traffic from Inkscape Community (and 
Inkscape for Cutting Design), as I have always promised.  But that still leaves 
InkscapeForum open.  And as long as it's open, those people who answer questions 
there will not be helping in the new forum.

        Oooohhhh....!!  I think I just saw the light!  One of the people who 
should definitely, most definitely, receive an announcement about the opening of 
a new official forum, would be the owners of the other forums.  Possibly more 
than one announcement might be needed.  But that *could* work!

        Shall I re-title this (or start a new thread), and move towards forming 
the documentation and management for the new forum?  Is anyone else on board? 
(We could even invite the moderators of InkscapeForum if they want to be 
involved, although most probably won't.)

All best,
brynn

-----Original Message----- 
From: doctormo@...155...
Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2019 9:20 AM
To: Inkscape User Community
Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?

Hi Brynn,

On the subject of development: It's not still in development, slowed or
stopped. It's waiting for management. Think of me as a resource to be
used to help get this project off the ground, not as a manager who is
driving it.

On membership: I wouldn't focus too much on the old forum, focus on
building a new forum with new members. We haven't done any marketing
for the new forum, haven't invited people from our other outreach
areas.

I don't know who told you we should keep the forum closed until the old
forum is dead. But that's a terrible strategy. The new forum is a solid
base, but what it needs is a fresh population, not resentful users from
previous forums.

But this is just my thoughts on membership. It's really up to the
management.

Best Regards, Martin Owens

On Sat, 2019-01-26 at 00:02 -0700, brynn wrote:
> Oh yes, I realize the new forum is still being worked on.  I didn't
> mean to
> imply it wasn't.  I just had the impression it had slowed down, and
> there was no
> longer a priority to get it open.
>
> I was told the plan was to let the old forum keep running as long as
> it will,
> which to me, is the same limbo we've been in, for so long now.  (And
> in my
> opinion, not a good idea, for what I thought would be obvious
> reasons.)
>
> I'm definitely commited, but since I don't have the development
> skills, I don't
> understand what work still needs to be done.  So I think it would be
> helpful to
> make a plan -- at least to have an outline of the next steps, so that
> everyone
> is on the same page.
>
> If the folks working on the development could say what still needs to
> be done, I
> could write up tasks in a gitlab Issue (I'm not sure if there already
> is an
> issue or not, but I'll look).
>
> And there's another potential problem that needs to be addressed as
> well
> (probably a few actually).  It seems most of the membership of
> InkscapeForum is
> not interested in the new forum.  When I posted the message inviting
> them to
> test it, there was little to no response.  I didn't specifically
> address the
> fact that the old forum would be closed, and they didn't seem to pick
> up on the
> many hints.  It sounds like they are expecting the old forum to stay
> open.  We
> haven't broached that subject of closing it yet, publicly (except for
> this
> message - I'm not sure if any forum members subscribe to this list).
>
> Plus, they somehow think I instigated the new forum, which renewed
> the same wild
> assumptions they made when I opened Inkscape Community (that I wanted
> to take
> over, or divide the forum, or steal members, or whatever nonsense
> they
> imagined).
>
> So when the time comes to open the new forum and close the old one,
> that word
> will need to come probably from the board.  In any case, I should
> probably no
> longer be "the messenger" regarding the new forum.
>
> If you need forum management, maybe we need to work up the forum
> rules or
> guidelines (or whatever we call them)?  And then we could go about
> setting up
> admins and moderators.  Is that the kind of management you mean?
>
> I'm not sure how we could use the forum any further, at this
> point.  It seems to
> have been tested in every way I can think of, except for heavy
> traffic.  I don't
> think it should be opened until we're ready to close the old one, for
> several
> reasons.
>
> But if you could share your list of paper cuts which still need
> fixing, I could
> help in prioritizing them.  (Maren might help too??)
>
> If we could find a way for the board to explain that the old forum is
> going to
> be closed, the members might be more willing to test the new
> forum?  Maybe
> they'd be more willing to be on the new staff too??  Here's the forum
> thread
> where I invited members to test the new forum:
> http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=34311  So you can
> see how
> they're resistant.  I'm not sure how the best way to word it would
> be, but we
> could discuss it in real time, at some point, probably better than in
> email.
>
> All best,
> brynn
>
>
>
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: doctormo@...155...
> Sent: Friday, January 25, 2019 6:15 PM
> To: Inkscape User Community
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
>
> Hi Brynn,
>
> Sorry if it seems like the website forum is in limbo, it's not. It's
> very functional I think on the core and has a great number of the
> functionalities asked for.
>
> The questions now are so fold:
>
> 1. Do we have someone like yourself who is willing and able to doing
> the management work to make the new forum work? We need people who
> are
> committed being in the key seats to really get things moving.
>
> 2. The inkscape-web team is at your disposal. (or at the disposal of
> the management of the forum). It will from time to time appear like I
> get distracted easily like a dog chasing squirrels. And that
> appearance
> is entirely true. Greater use of the forum, and direction by someone
> in
> charge would greatly help keeping things focused and prioritising
> which
> of the many small paper-cuts is the most important.
>
> Best Regards, Martin Owens
>
> On Fri, 2019-01-25 at 23:41 +0000, C R wrote:
> > Correct if wrong, but I got the impression that it's still being
> > worked on.
> > I'm liaising with Doctormo, and Jabier to try and integrate the
> > visual stylings of the new forum with our current website.
> > If it's true that we're going back into a state of limbo do tell me
> > so I don't do extra work for nothing! :)
>
>
>