PDF export seems chopped off at the top with margin at bottom
Folks,
I am trying to get a tight bounding box around a single exclamation mark input as text at large font size, selected, converted from text to path, and saved as a PDF, from within Inkscape.
I have used
Path-> Object to path
and
File -> Document properties -> Page -> Fit page to selection
and exported as PDF.
There seems to be a margin beyond the object at the bottom, and the top of the object is cut off, possibly by the same amount. This is seen when viewing the exported PDF at 6400% in Acroread.
The dotted box that appears in Inkscape when the object is selected appears perfect. The settings for snapping to grid/object/path have been toggled with no change in behaviour of the exported file.
I can post PDFs illustrating this if told where to post them.
Is this a bug, and if so, is there a workaround?
Thanks.
Chandra 30 Apr 07
R (Chandra) Chandrasekhar wrote:
Is this a bug, and if so, is there a workaround?
I still do not know whether this is a bug, but the workaround is:
1. Skip the "Fit page to selection" step and export as PDF; and
2. Use the pdfcrop utility, written by Heiko Oberdiek, and available from:
http://www.ctan.org/tex-archive/support/pdfcrop/
to crop the file saved in (1) to the correct bounding box dimensions.
System requirements for pdfcrop are also given at the above address.
The resulting bounding box and PDF file is accurate when viewed at 6400% with Acroread.
Chandra 06 May 07
Thanks for reporting back about the workaround you found - people browsing the archive with this problem in the future will appreciate the answer.
I don't know specifically what is causing the problem but it sort of sounds like an A4 vs. letter paper size assumption being hardcoded somewhere?
Bryce
On Sun, May 06, 2007 at 11:10:57AM +0800, R (Chandra) Chandrasekhar wrote:
R (Chandra) Chandrasekhar wrote:
Is this a bug, and if so, is there a workaround?
I still do not know whether this is a bug, but the workaround is:
Skip the "Fit page to selection" step and export as PDF; and
Use the pdfcrop utility, written by Heiko Oberdiek, and available from:
to crop the file saved in (1) to the correct bounding box dimensions.
System requirements for pdfcrop are also given at the above address.
The resulting bounding box and PDF file is accurate when viewed at 6400% with Acroread.
Chandra 06 May 07
R (Chandra) Chandrasekhar ha scritto:
R (Chandra) Chandrasekhar wrote:
Is this a bug, and if so, is there a workaround?
I still do not know whether this is a bug, but the workaround is:
Skip the "Fit page to selection" step and export as PDF; and
Use the pdfcrop utility, written by Heiko Oberdiek, and available from:
to crop the file saved in (1) to the correct bounding box dimensions.
System requirements for pdfcrop are also given at the above address.
The resulting bounding box and PDF file is accurate when viewed at 6400% with Acroread.
Or you may export to eps and use epstopdf, which computes the correct bounding box and IMHO creates a nicer PDF. I've written a simple extension to automate this process, you can find it attached to this post. Beware, it's my first extension and I haven't been using python for a long time; anyway, it works for me.
Davide davide125@...152...
<inkscape-extension> <name>PDF Output (epstopdf)</name> <id>org.inkscape.output.epstopdf</id> <dependency type="extension">org.inkscape.output.eps</dependency> <dependency type="executable" location="extensions">eps2pdf.py</dependency> <dependency type="executable">epstopdf</dependency> <output> <extension>.pdf</extension> <mimetype>image/x-portable-document-format</mimetype> <filetypename>PDF via epstopdf (*.pdf)</filetypename> <filetypetooltip>Adobe Portable Document Format (via epstopdf)</filetypetooltip> </output> <script> <command reldir="extensions" interpreter="python">eps2pdf.py</command> <helper_extension>org.inkscape.output.eps</helper_extension> </script> </inkscape-extension>
#!/usr/bin/env python ''' Copyright (C) 2007 Davide Cavalca <davide125@...152...>
This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify it under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
This program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. See the GNU General Public License for more details.
You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License along with this program; if not, write to the Free Software Foundation, Inc., 59 Temple Place, Suite 330, Boston, MA 02111-1307 USA '''
import inkex import sys, os
# Win32's stdout must be set in binary mode to write PDF data # http://aspn.activestate.com/ASPN/Cookbook/Python/Recipe/65443 if sys.platform == "win32": import msvcrt msvcrt.setmode(sys.stdout.fileno(), os.O_BINARY)
class MyEffect(inkex.Effect): def __init__(self): inkex.Effect.__init__(self) def output(self): pass def effect(self): eps_file = self.args[-1] command = "epstopdf --filter" eps_in = open(eps_file,'rb') cin, cout = os.popen2(command,'b') cin.write(eps_in.read()) eps_in.close() cin.close() sys.stdout.write(cout.read()) cout.close() sys.stdout.flush()
# I'm not using affect() because it calls parse() which attempts to parse input # file (which is eps, not svg since we depend from the eps filter e = MyEffect() e.getoptions() e.effect()
(I'm reposting this due to mail problems, sorry if you get a duplicate) R (Chandra) Chandrasekhar ha scritto:
R (Chandra) Chandrasekhar wrote:
Is this a bug, and if so, is there a workaround?
I still do not know whether this is a bug, but the workaround is:
Skip the "Fit page to selection" step and export as PDF; and
Use the pdfcrop utility, written by Heiko Oberdiek, and available
from:
http://www.ctan.org/tex-archive/support/pdfcrop/to crop the file saved in (1) to the correct bounding box dimensions.
System requirements for pdfcrop are also given at the above address.
The resulting bounding box and PDF file is accurate when viewed at 6400% with Acroread.
Or you may export to eps and use epstopdf, which computes the correct bounding box and IMHO creates a nicer PDF. I've written a simple extension to automate this process, you can find it attached to this post. Beware, it's my first extension and I haven't been using python for a long time; anyway, it works for me.
Davide davide125@...152...
<inkscape-extension> <name>PDF Output (epstopdf)</name> <id>org.inkscape.output.epstopdf</id> <dependency type="extension">org.inkscape.output.eps</dependency> <dependency type="executable" location="extensions">eps2pdf.py</dependency> <dependency type="executable">epstopdf</dependency> <output> <extension>.pdf</extension> <mimetype>image/x-portable-document-format</mimetype> <filetypename>PDF via epstopdf (*.pdf)</filetypename> <filetypetooltip>Adobe Portable Document Format (via epstopdf)</filetypetooltip> </output> <script> <command reldir="extensions" interpreter="python">eps2pdf.py</command> <helper_extension>org.inkscape.output.eps</helper_extension> </script> </inkscape-extension>
#!/usr/bin/env python ''' Copyright (C) 2007 Davide Cavalca <davide125@...152...>
This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify it under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.
This program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. See the GNU General Public License for more details.
You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License along with this program; if not, write to the Free Software Foundation, Inc., 59 Temple Place, Suite 330, Boston, MA 02111-1307 USA '''
import inkex import sys, os
# Win32's stdout must be set in binary mode to write PDF data # http://aspn.activestate.com/ASPN/Cookbook/Python/Recipe/65443 if sys.platform == "win32": import msvcrt msvcrt.setmode(sys.stdout.fileno(), os.O_BINARY)
class MyEffect(inkex.Effect): def __init__(self): inkex.Effect.__init__(self) def output(self): pass def effect(self): eps_file = self.args[-1] command = "epstopdf --filter" eps_in = open(eps_file,'rb') cin, cout = os.popen2(command,'b') cin.write(eps_in.read()) eps_in.close() cin.close() sys.stdout.write(cout.read()) cout.close() sys.stdout.flush()
# I'm not using affect() because it calls parse() which attempts to parse input # file (which is eps, not svg since we depend from the eps filter e = MyEffect() e.getoptions() e.effect()
The 3d edge effect is uploaded here:
edge3d.py - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.inx - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.svg (docs) - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
The Ruby based Puff effect at http://www.colivre.coop.br/bin/view/Aurium/Puff is neat, different approach, similar result, maybe more robust. I've included a link to the Puff version in the docs. for the path based Python version above.
Cheers -Terry
Hey Terry or anybody else,
I installed the puff and ruby extension on my machine. Neither of them seems to do something. I'm assuming that I extracted them to the correct directory because I see them both the misc -> puff under the effects now. I also see test-> Ruby Change Color. This also seems to have no effect.
I should probably clarify. I do get a dialog to pop up when I ask inkscape to run the puff effect. I have the default value of 20 pixels and click ok. No script runs to execute anything like all the other extensions.
I'm running on evil windows xp. Inkscape version 0.45.1.
Some what disappointed as I had to extract the ruby.tar.gz file on linux machine to do the install and nothing works.
Thanks,
Aaron
On 5/9/07, Terry Brown <terry_n_brown@...12...> wrote:
The 3d edge effect is uploaded here:
edge3d.py -
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.inx -
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.svg (docs) -
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
The Ruby based Puff effect at http://www.colivre.coop.br/bin/view/Aurium/Puff is neat, different approach, similar result, maybe more robust. I've included a link to the Puff version in the docs. for the path based Python version above.
Cheers -Terry
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Also for some reason I can't get edge3d.py to download. Sourceforge keeps giving me a 'invalid file id' error. And yes I am using the link provided in the e-mail.
I can't get puff or Ruby to work either. :( M$XP - Inkscape 0.45.1
Aaron Elmquist <ironranger@...155...> wrote: Hey Terry or anybody else,
I installed the puff and ruby extension on my machine. Neither of them seems to do something. I'm assuming that I extracted them to the correct directory because I see them both the misc -> puff under the effects now. I also see test-> Ruby Change Color. This also seems to have no effect.
I should probably clarify. I do get a dialog to pop up when I ask inkscape to run the puff effect. I have the default value of 20 pixels and click ok. No script runs to execute anything like all the other extensions.
I'm running on evil windows xp. Inkscape version 0.45.1.
Some what disappointed as I had to extract the ruby.tar.gz file on linux machine to do the install and nothing works.
Thanks,
Aaron
On 5/9/07, Terry Brown <terry_n_brown@...12...> wrote: The 3d edge effect is uploaded here:
edge3d.py - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.inx - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.svg (docs) - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
The Ruby based Puff effect at http://www.colivre.coop.br/bin/view/Aurium/Puff is neat, different approach, similar result, maybe more robust. I've included a link to the Puff version in the docs. for the path based Python version above.
Cheers -Terry
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I think a quick web search might have answered my question. I'm downloading ruby for my machine now. I'll install it and see if that produces the desired effect.
On 5/9/07, Terry Brown <terry_n_brown@...12...> wrote:
The 3d edge effect is uploaded here:
edge3d.py -
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.inx -
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.svg (docs) -
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
The Ruby based Puff effect at http://www.colivre.coop.br/bin/view/Aurium/Puff is neat, different approach, similar result, maybe more robust. I've included a link to the Puff version in the docs. for the path based Python version above.
Cheers -Terry
This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ _______________________________________________ Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
Well if you figure it out, please share. As I am pretty sure that we aren't the only ones having trouble with puff, Ruby, or 3D edge effect. Especially on M$$$$$XP.
Aaron Elmquist <ironranger@...155...> wrote: I think a quick web search might have answered my question. I'm downloading ruby for my machine now. I'll install it and see if that produces the desired effect.
On 5/9/07, Terry Brown <terry_n_brown@...12...> wrote: The 3d edge effect is uploaded here:
edge3d.py - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.inx - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.svg (docs) - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
The Ruby based Puff effect at http://www.colivre.coop.br/bin/view/Aurium/Puff is neat, different approach, similar result, maybe more robust. I've included a link to the Puff version in the docs. for the path based Python version above.
Cheers -Terry
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Sammey,
I'm going to play with this over the weekend. I'll let you know if I get things to work.
Later,
Aaron
On 5/10/07, SammeyDW <samnnes@...12...> wrote:
Well if you figure it out, please share. As I am pretty sure that we aren't the only ones having trouble with puff, Ruby, or 3D edge effect. Especially on M$$$$$XP.
*Aaron Elmquist <ironranger@...155...>* wrote:
I think a quick web search might have answered my question. I'm downloading ruby for my machine now. I'll install it and see if that produces the desired effect.
On 5/9/07, Terry Brown <terry_n_brown@...12...> wrote:
The 3d edge effect is uploaded here:
edge3d.py - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.inx - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.svg (docs) - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
The Ruby based Puff effect at http://www.colivre.coop.br/bin/view/Aurium/Puff is neat, different approach, similar result, maybe more robust. I've included a link to the Puff version in the docs. for the path based Python version above.
Cheers -Terry
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Sammey,
By the way, how did you extract/unzip the ruby.tar.gz archive? This is a linux format. I was able to I have access to a Fedora machine and extracted the archive on their and transfered the files to my xp machine.
On 5/10/07, SammeyDW <samnnes@...12...> wrote:
Well if you figure it out, please share. As I am pretty sure that we aren't the only ones having trouble with puff, Ruby, or 3D edge effect. Especially on M$$$$$XP.
*Aaron Elmquist <ironranger@...155...>* wrote:
I think a quick web search might have answered my question. I'm downloading ruby for my machine now. I'll install it and see if that produces the desired effect.
On 5/9/07, Terry Brown <terry_n_brown@...12...> wrote:
The 3d edge effect is uploaded here:
edge3d.py - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.inx - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.svg (docs) - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
The Ruby based Puff effect at http://www.colivre.coop.br/bin/view/Aurium/Puff is neat, different approach, similar result, maybe more robust. I've included a link to the Puff version in the docs. for the path based Python version above.
Cheers -Terry
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Sorry guys, I messed up and uploaded the wrong version of my edge3d.py file yesterday. I've uploaded the correct one now.
Rather than give another direct file link that would go bad when the file's replaced / updated, here's a link to the patch page:
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1715294&gr...
The download links for the .py and .inx files you need are at the bottom of the page:
edge3d.py Download edge3d.svg Docs for edge3d effect Download edge3d.inx .inx file for 3d edge effect using blured paths Download
Remember to do Path>Object to Path to use it on shapes that aren't paths. That's in the docs, but I just forgot and was about to start cursing XP for not providing atan() or something weird like that :-)
As far as Puff's concerned, nothing to do with me, but I'd guess you need Ruby installed and on the path, and the Puff and RubyInk (or was it InkRuby) files copied to .../inkscape/share/extensions (on XP) or in ~/.inkscape/extensions in linux.
Let me know if you have any more trouble / ideas for the edge3d approach.
Cheers -Terry
Hmm, just noticed a bitmap of the edge3d ui is missing in the .svg docs. file, but it's not really essential, I'll try and fix it.
Thank you Terry. 3D Edge is now working fine as far as I can tell.
Terry Brown <terry_n_brown@...12...> wrote: Sorry guys, I messed up and uploaded the wrong version of my edge3d.py file yesterday. I've uploaded the correct one now.
Rather than give another direct file link that would go bad when the file's replaced / updated, here's a link to the patch page:
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1715294&gr...
The download links for the .py and .inx files you need are at the bottom of the page:
edge3d.py Download edge3d.svg Docs for edge3d effect Download edge3d.inx .inx file for 3d edge effect using blured paths Download
Remember to do Path>Object to Path to use it on shapes that aren't paths. That's in the docs, but I just forgot and was about to start cursing XP for not providing atan() or something weird like that :-)
As far as Puff's concerned, nothing to do with me, but I'd guess you need Ruby installed and on the path, and the Puff and RubyInk (or was it InkRuby) files copied to .../inkscape/share/extensions (on XP) or in ~/.inkscape/extensions in linux.
Let me know if you have any more trouble / ideas for the edge3d approach.
Cheers -Terry
Hmm, just noticed a bitmap of the edge3d ui is missing in the .svg docs. file, but it's not really essential, I'll try and fix it.
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SammeyDW wrote the following on 5/10/2007 12:42 PM:
Thank you Terry. 3D Edge is now working fine as far as I can tell.
mine's working too. pretty neat effect. i wish we had a lot more extensions like this. what a great way of adding functionality to inkscape...and saving time.
heathenx
Working great here too. Very nice.
Cheers
Sim
On 5/10/07, heathenx <heathenx@...155...> wrote:
SammeyDW wrote the following on 5/10/2007 12:42 PM:
Thank you Terry. 3D Edge is now working fine as far as I can tell.
mine's working too. pretty neat effect. i wish we had a lot more extensions like this. what a great way of adding functionality to inkscape...and saving time.
heathenx
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Great, it is working well too in OSX 10.4.9
Thanx Le 10 mai 07 à 19:11, heathenx a écrit :
SammeyDW wrote the following on 5/10/2007 12:42 PM:
Thank you Terry. 3D Edge is now working fine as far as I can tell.
mine's working too. pretty neat effect. i wish we had a lot more extensions like this. what a great way of adding functionality to inkscape...and saving time.
heathenx
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Aaron Elmquist wrote the following on 5/10/2007 10:04 AM:
Sammey,
By the way, how did you extract/unzip the ruby.tar.gz archive? This is a linux format. I was able to I have access to a Fedora machine and extracted the archive on their and transfered the files to my xp machine.
actually, if you have winzip or winrar installed you'll be able to uncompress it in windows.
heathenx
Good to know, but I don't have winzip installed right now. I'll have to download it.
On 5/10/07, heathenx <heathenx@...155...> wrote:
Aaron Elmquist wrote the following on 5/10/2007 10:04 AM:
Sammey,
By the way, how did you extract/unzip the ruby.tar.gz archive? This is a linux format. I was able to I have access to a Fedora machine and extracted the archive on their and transfered the files to my xp machine.
actually, if you have winzip or winrar installed you'll be able to uncompress it in windows.
heathenx
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7Zip It works on common linux , and winduhs formats, as well as some 'not so common' formats.
Portable version - http://portableapps.com/apps/utilities/7-zip_portable Non - Portable version - http://www.7-zip.org/
PS. The Portable version runs just fine off the HD. You just lose the ability to associate some of the file types with 7zip. But functionality wise you don't lose a thing.
Aaron Elmquist <ironranger@...155...> wrote: Sammey,
By the way, how did you extract/unzip the ruby.tar.gz archive? This is a linux format. I was able to I have access to a Fedora machine and extracted the archive on their and transfered the files to my xp machine.
On 5/10/07, SammeyDW <samnnes@...12...> wrote: Well if you figure it out, please share. As I am pretty sure that we aren't the only ones having trouble with puff, Ruby, or 3D edge effect. Especially on M$$$$$XP.
Aaron Elmquist <ironranger@...155...> wrote: I think a quick web search might have answered my question. I'm downloading ruby for my machine now. I'll install it and see if that produces the desired effect.
On 5/9/07, Terry Brown <terry_n_brown@...12... > wrote: The 3d edge effect is uploaded here:
edge3d.py - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.inx - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.svg (docs) - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
The Ruby based Puff effect at http://www.colivre.coop.br/bin/view/Aurium/Puff is neat, different approach, similar result, maybe more robust. I've included a link to the Puff version in the docs. for the path based Python version above.
Cheers -Terry
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Thanks for the link. Looks like a good one.
On 5/10/07, SammeyDW <samnnes@...12...> wrote:
7Zip It works on common linux , and winduhs formats, as well as some 'not so common' formats.
Portable version - http://portableapps.com/apps/utilities/7-zip_portable Non - Portable version - http://www.7-zip.org/
PS. The Portable version runs just fine off the HD. You just lose the ability to associate some of the file types with 7zip. But functionality wise you don't lose a thing.
*Aaron Elmquist <ironranger@...155...>* wrote:
Sammey,
By the way, how did you extract/unzip the ruby.tar.gz archive? This is a linux format. I was able to I have access to a Fedora machine and extracted the archive on their and transfered the files to my xp machine.
On 5/10/07, SammeyDW <samnnes@...12...> wrote:
Well if you figure it out, please share. As I am pretty sure that we aren't the only ones having trouble with puff, Ruby, or 3D edge effect. Especially on M$$$$$XP.
*Aaron Elmquist <ironranger@...155...>* wrote:
I think a quick web search might have answered my question. I'm downloading ruby for my machine now. I'll install it and see if that produces the desired effect.
On 5/9/07, Terry Brown <terry_n_brown@...12... > wrote:
The 3d edge effect is uploaded here:
edge3d.py - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.inx - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
edge3d.svg (docs) - https://sourceforge.net/tracker/download.php?group_id=93438&atid=604308&...
The Ruby based Puff effect at http://www.colivre.coop.br/bin/view/Aurium/Puff is neat, different approach, similar result, maybe more robust. I've included a link to the Puff version in the docs. for the path based Python version above.
Cheers -Terry
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Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos.http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48245/*http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html;_ylc=X3oDMTE1YW1jcXJ2BF9TAzk3MTA3MDc2BHNlYwNtYWlsdGFncwRzbGsDbmV3LWNhcnM-
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This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now.
http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/________________________________________... Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos.http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48245/*http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html;_ylc=X3oDMTE1YW1jcXJ2BF9TAzk3MTA3MDc2BHNlYwNtYWlsdGFncwRzbGsDbmV3LWNhcnM-
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participants (9)
-
Aaron Elmquist -
Bryce Harrington -
Davide Cavalca -
heathenx -
Jean-Maurice Le Clech -
john cliff -
R (Chandra) Chandrasekhar -
SammeyDW -
Terry Brown