Hello everyone,
I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing some painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share right now, sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 with an i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM.
The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature that might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects that can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit boards). The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small objects; it happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and even changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such operation I get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when zoomed out is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing.
Another thing that's happening that could be related is the following prompts keep appearing on the console:
(inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: pango_font_family_list_faces: assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed
(inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed
I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover if they are related to the performance problems.
Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've tried:
* Running with fresh preferences.xml * Geometric bounding box * Reducing the complexity of the design * Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are relevant for the operation (usually only two layers) * Hiding rulers and scroll-bars * Maximising memory and threads (with restart)
I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to recommend something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I can share so that we could work though it.
Thanks, Saar.
Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur / transparency or other?
I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming in paths with bitmap patterns on them.
Mvh
/Olof ----------------- 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello everyone,
I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing some painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share right now, sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 with an i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM.
The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature that might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects that can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit boards). The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small objects; it happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and even changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such operation I get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when zoomed out is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing.
Another thing that's happening that could be related is the following prompts keep appearing on the console:
(inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: pango_font_family_list_faces: assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed
(inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed
I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover if they are related to the performance problems.
Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've tried:
- Running with fresh preferences.xml
- Geometric bounding box
- Reducing the complexity of the design
- Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are relevant
for the operation (usually only two layers)
- Hiding rulers and scroll-bars
- Maximising memory and threads (with restart)
I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to recommend something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I can share so that we could work though it.
Thanks, Saar.
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Hello Olof,
The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements do, however, have some degree of transparency.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur / transparency or other?
I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming in paths with bitmap patterns on them.
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello everyone,
I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing some painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share right now, sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 with an i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM.
The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature that might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects that can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit boards). The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small objects; it happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and even changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such operation I get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when zoomed out is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing.
Another thing that's happening that could be related is the following prompts keep appearing on the console:
(inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: pango_font_family_list_faces: assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed
(inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed
I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover if they are related to the performance problems.
Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've tried:
- Running with fresh preferences.xml
- Geometric bounding box
- Reducing the complexity of the design
- Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are relevant
for the operation (usually only two layers)
- Hiding rulers and scroll-bars
- Maximising memory and threads (with restart)
I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to recommend something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I can share so that we could work though it.
Thanks, Saar.
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Mvh
/Olof ----------------- 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 10:43, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello Olof,
The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements do, however, have some degree of transparency.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur / transparency or other?
I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming in paths with bitmap patterns on them.
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello everyone,
I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing some painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share right
now,
sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 with an i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM.
The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature that might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects that can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit boards). The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small objects; it happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and even changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such operation I get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when zoomed out is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing.
Another thing that's happening that could be related is the following prompts keep appearing on the console:
(inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: pango_font_family_list_faces: assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed
(inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed
I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover if they are related to the performance problems.
Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've tried:
- Running with fresh preferences.xml
- Geometric bounding box
- Reducing the complexity of the design
- Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are relevant
for the operation (usually only two layers)
- Hiding rulers and scroll-bars
- Maximising memory and threads (with restart)
I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to recommend something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I can share so that we could work though it.
Thanks, Saar.
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Just tried by removing all opacity. Doesn't make a difference.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 10:43, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello Olof,
The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements do, however, have some degree of transparency.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur / transparency or other?
I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming in paths with bitmap patterns on them.
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello everyone,
I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing some painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share right now, sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 with an i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM.
The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature that might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects that can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit boards). The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small objects; it happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and even changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such operation I get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when zoomed out is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing.
Another thing that's happening that could be related is the following prompts keep appearing on the console:
(inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: pango_font_family_list_faces: assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed
(inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed
I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover if they are related to the performance problems.
Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've tried:
- Running with fresh preferences.xml
- Geometric bounding box
- Reducing the complexity of the design
- Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are relevant
for the operation (usually only two layers)
- Hiding rulers and scroll-bars
- Maximising memory and threads (with restart)
I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to recommend something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I can share so that we could work though it.
Thanks, Saar.
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
I decided to quickly stress test this, making a 100 point star, replicating it 50 times, converting the objects to geometry, then shrinking them all down to .5mm and zooming to 12800%
Result: There is some slowdown, but not nearly as much as I was expecting. This is on a 4 year old laptop running Ubuntu Linux with Gnome 3.
What does slow it down a lot more however is taking those 50 objects, and ctrl-k converting them to a single object. The slowdown is approximately 10x slower than what it was before.
If this is what's slowing you down, my advice would be to break your large (in number of points) object up into multiple objects while editing, then recombine them when done.
ctrl-shift-k to break apart, and ctrl+k to recombine.
-C
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Just tried by removing all opacity. Doesn't make a difference.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 10:43, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello Olof,
The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements do, however, have some degree of transparency.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur / transparency or other?
I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming in paths with bitmap patterns on them.
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till
Android.
https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello everyone,
I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing some painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share right now, sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 with an i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM.
The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature that might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects that can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit boards). The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small objects;
it
happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and even changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such operation I get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when zoomed
out
is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing.
Another thing that's happening that could be related is the following prompts keep appearing on the console:
(inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: pango_font_family_list_faces: assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed
(inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed
I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover if they are related to the performance problems.
Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've tried:
- Running with fresh preferences.xml
- Geometric bounding box
- Reducing the complexity of the design
- Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are relevant
for the operation (usually only two layers)
- Hiding rulers and scroll-bars
- Maximising memory and threads (with restart)
I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to recommend something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I can share so that we could work though it.
Thanks, Saar.
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785351&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
In this particular instance there aren't any objects with 'lots' of nodes.
I'm attaching a design where the performance issued are less severe than the one I'm experiencing with a design I cannot share, although the complexity of the latter is not that much greater. They are both generated by the same software, so should exhibit similar 'symptoms'. Things get clunky when zoomed in and after a while of editing and zooming in and out. Hiding layers doesn't seem to make much difference. Maybe this could shed some light on the issue?
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:49 AM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote:
I decided to quickly stress test this, making a 100 point star, replicating it 50 times, converting the objects to geometry, then shrinking them all down to .5mm and zooming to 12800%
Result: There is some slowdown, but not nearly as much as I was expecting. This is on a 4 year old laptop running Ubuntu Linux with Gnome 3.
What does slow it down a lot more however is taking those 50 objects, and ctrl-k converting them to a single object. The slowdown is approximately 10x slower than what it was before.
If this is what's slowing you down, my advice would be to break your large (in number of points) object up into multiple objects while editing, then recombine them when done.
ctrl-shift-k to break apart, and ctrl+k to recombine.
-C
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Just tried by removing all opacity. Doesn't make a difference.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 10:43, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello Olof,
The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements do, however, have some degree of transparency.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur / transparency or other?
I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming in paths with bitmap patterns on them.
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello everyone,
I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing some painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share right now, sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 with an i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM.
The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature that might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects that can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit boards). The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small objects; it happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and even changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such operation I get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when zoomed out is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing.
Another thing that's happening that could be related is the following prompts keep appearing on the console:
(inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: pango_font_family_list_faces: assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed
(inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed
I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover if they are related to the performance problems.
Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've tried:
- Running with fresh preferences.xml
- Geometric bounding box
- Reducing the complexity of the design
- Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are relevant
for the operation (usually only two layers)
- Hiding rulers and scroll-bars
- Maximising memory and threads (with restart)
I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to recommend something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I can share so that we could work though it.
Thanks, Saar.
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785351&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Reinstalled Inkscape 0.91 r13725 Can't reproduce the slowdown on my laptop, even zoomed in to 25600%.
My system: i5-2520M @ 2.5GHz x 4 64-bit, 16GB RAM
Ubuntu 15.10 running Gnome 3.16.4
Inkscape trunk does feel faster by a bit, but I'm not getting any significant lag in 0.91 either.
Saar, are you using Unity by chance?
Thanks. -C
On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 12:42 PM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
In this particular instance there aren't any objects with 'lots' of nodes.
I'm attaching a design where the performance issued are less severe than the one I'm experiencing with a design I cannot share, although the complexity of the latter is not that much greater. They are both generated by the same software, so should exhibit similar 'symptoms'. Things get clunky when zoomed in and after a while of editing and zooming in and out. Hiding layers doesn't seem to make much difference. Maybe this could shed some light on the issue?
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:49 AM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote:
I decided to quickly stress test this, making a 100 point star,
replicating
it 50 times, converting the objects to geometry, then shrinking them all down to .5mm and zooming to 12800%
Result: There is some slowdown, but not nearly as much as I was
expecting.
This is on a 4 year old laptop running Ubuntu Linux with Gnome 3.
What does slow it down a lot more however is taking those 50 objects, and ctrl-k converting them to a single object. The slowdown is approximately
10x
slower than what it was before.
If this is what's slowing you down, my advice would be to break your
large
(in number of points) object up into multiple objects while editing, then recombine them when done.
ctrl-shift-k to break apart, and ctrl+k to recombine.
-C
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Just tried by removing all opacity. Doesn't make a difference.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till
Android.
https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 10:43, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello Olof,
The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements do, however, have some degree of transparency.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur
/
transparency or other?
I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming in paths with bitmap patterns on them.
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: > > Hello everyone, > > I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing
some
> painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share > right > now, > sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 with > an > i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM. > > The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature
that
> might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects
that
> can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit > boards). > The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small
objects;
> it > happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and
even
> changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such
operation
> I > get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when zoomed > out > is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing. > > Another thing that's happening that could be related is the > following > prompts keep appearing on the console: > > (inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: pango_font_family_list_faces: > assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed > > (inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **:
IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell:
> assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed > > I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover
if
> they are related to the performance problems. > > Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've
tried:
> > * Running with fresh preferences.xml > * Geometric bounding box > * Reducing the complexity of the design > * Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are
relevant
> for the operation (usually only two layers) > * Hiding rulers and scroll-bars > * Maximising memory and threads (with restart) > > I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to
recommend
> something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I can > share so that we could work though it. > > Thanks, > Saar. > > > > >
> Transform Data into Opportunity. > Accelerate data analysis in your applications with > Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. > Click to learn more. > http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 > _______________________________________________ > Inkscape-devel mailing list > Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785351&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Yes, I use Unity on both computers. After installing Gnome, there's no difference, though.
Cheers, Saar.
On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 1:41 PM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote:
Reinstalled Inkscape 0.91 r13725 Can't reproduce the slowdown on my laptop, even zoomed in to 25600%.
My system: i5-2520M @ 2.5GHz x 4 64-bit, 16GB RAM
Ubuntu 15.10 running Gnome 3.16.4
Inkscape trunk does feel faster by a bit, but I'm not getting any significant lag in 0.91 either.
Saar, are you using Unity by chance?
Thanks. -C
On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 12:42 PM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
In this particular instance there aren't any objects with 'lots' of nodes.
I'm attaching a design where the performance issued are less severe than the one I'm experiencing with a design I cannot share, although the complexity of the latter is not that much greater. They are both generated by the same software, so should exhibit similar 'symptoms'. Things get clunky when zoomed in and after a while of editing and zooming in and out. Hiding layers doesn't seem to make much difference. Maybe this could shed some light on the issue?
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:49 AM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote:
I decided to quickly stress test this, making a 100 point star, replicating it 50 times, converting the objects to geometry, then shrinking them all down to .5mm and zooming to 12800%
Result: There is some slowdown, but not nearly as much as I was expecting. This is on a 4 year old laptop running Ubuntu Linux with Gnome 3.
What does slow it down a lot more however is taking those 50 objects, and ctrl-k converting them to a single object. The slowdown is approximately 10x slower than what it was before.
If this is what's slowing you down, my advice would be to break your large (in number of points) object up into multiple objects while editing, then recombine them when done.
ctrl-shift-k to break apart, and ctrl+k to recombine.
-C
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Just tried by removing all opacity. Doesn't make a difference.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 10:43, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello Olof,
The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements do, however, have some degree of transparency.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote: > Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur > / > transparency or other? > > I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming > in > paths > with bitmap patterns on them. > > > > Mvh > > > /Olof > ----------------- > 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? > Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till > Android. > https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem > > > On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> Hello everyone, >> >> I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing >> some >> painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share >> right >> now, >> sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 >> with >> an >> i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM. >> >> The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature >> that >> might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects >> that >> can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit >> boards). >> The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small >> objects; >> it >> happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and >> even >> changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such >> operation >> I >> get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when >> zoomed >> out >> is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing. >> >> Another thing that's happening that could be related is the >> following >> prompts keep appearing on the console: >> >> (inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: >> pango_font_family_list_faces: >> assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed >> >> (inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: >> IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: >> assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed >> >> I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover >> if >> they are related to the performance problems. >> >> Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've >> tried: >> >> * Running with fresh preferences.xml >> * Geometric bounding box >> * Reducing the complexity of the design >> * Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are >> relevant >> for the operation (usually only two layers) >> * Hiding rulers and scroll-bars >> * Maximising memory and threads (with restart) >> >> I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to >> recommend >> something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I >> can >> share so that we could work though it. >> >> Thanks, >> Saar. >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Transform Data into Opportunity. >> Accelerate data analysis in your applications with >> Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. >> Click to learn more. >> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 >> _______________________________________________ >> Inkscape-devel mailing list >> Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel > >
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785351&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
The only other possible difference is that I have an SSD installed. However I don't think Inkscape pages memory to disk very much with 16GB of RAM handy. :) Or at least I'd hope not!
-C
On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 3:24 PM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Yes, I use Unity on both computers. After installing Gnome, there's no difference, though.
Cheers, Saar.
On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 1:41 PM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote:
Reinstalled Inkscape 0.91 r13725 Can't reproduce the slowdown on my laptop, even zoomed in to 25600%.
My system: i5-2520M @ 2.5GHz x 4 64-bit, 16GB RAM
Ubuntu 15.10 running Gnome 3.16.4
Inkscape trunk does feel faster by a bit, but I'm not getting any significant lag in 0.91 either.
Saar, are you using Unity by chance?
Thanks. -C
On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 12:42 PM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
In this particular instance there aren't any objects with 'lots' of
nodes.
I'm attaching a design where the performance issued are less severe than the one I'm experiencing with a design I cannot share, although the complexity of the latter is not that much greater. They are both generated by the same software, so should exhibit similar 'symptoms'. Things get clunky when zoomed in and after a while of editing and zooming in and out. Hiding layers doesn't seem to make much difference. Maybe this could shed some light on the issue?
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:49 AM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote:
I decided to quickly stress test this, making a 100 point star, replicating it 50 times, converting the objects to geometry, then shrinking them
all
down to .5mm and zooming to 12800%
Result: There is some slowdown, but not nearly as much as I was expecting. This is on a 4 year old laptop running Ubuntu Linux with Gnome 3.
What does slow it down a lot more however is taking those 50 objects, and ctrl-k converting them to a single object. The slowdown is
approximately
10x slower than what it was before.
If this is what's slowing you down, my advice would be to break your large (in number of points) object up into multiple objects while editing, then recombine them when done.
ctrl-shift-k to break apart, and ctrl+k to recombine.
-C
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...>
wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Just tried by removing all opacity. Doesn't make a difference.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 10:43, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: > > Hello Olof, > > The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the > settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements
do,
> however, have some degree of transparency. > > Thanks, > Saar. > > > > > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason > <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote: > > Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns,
blur
> > / > > transparency or other? > > > > I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming > > in > > paths > > with bitmap patterns on them. > > > > > > > > Mvh > > > > > > /Olof > > ----------------- > > 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? > > Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till > > Android. > > https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem > > > > > > On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...>
wrote:
> >> > >> Hello everyone, > >> > >> I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing > >> some > >> painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share > >> right > >> now, > >> sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 > >> with > >> an > >> i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM. > >> > >> The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature > >> that > >> might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects > >> that > >> can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit > >> boards). > >> The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small > >> objects; > >> it > >> happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and > >> even > >> changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such > >> operation > >> I > >> get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when > >> zoomed > >> out > >> is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing. > >> > >> Another thing that's happening that could be related is the > >> following > >> prompts keep appearing on the console: > >> > >> (inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: > >> pango_font_family_list_faces: > >> assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed > >> > >> (inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: > >> IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: > >> assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed > >> > >> I could not find any report for how to handle these, and
discover
> >> if > >> they are related to the performance problems. > >> > >> Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've > >> tried: > >> > >> * Running with fresh preferences.xml > >> * Geometric bounding box > >> * Reducing the complexity of the design > >> * Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are > >> relevant > >> for the operation (usually only two layers) > >> * Hiding rulers and scroll-bars > >> * Maximising memory and threads (with restart) > >> > >> I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to > >> recommend > >> something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I > >> can > >> share so that we could work though it. > >> > >> Thanks, > >> Saar. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>
> >> Transform Data into Opportunity. > >> Accelerate data analysis in your applications with > >> Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. > >> Click to learn more. > >>
http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140
> >> _______________________________________________ > >> Inkscape-devel mailing list > >> Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel > > > >
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785351&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Try disabling the ubuntu/unity scroll bars. They cause so many problems, maybe they cause this one too.
Martin,
On Mon, 2016-04-04 at 15:59 +0100, C R wrote:
The only other possible difference is that I have an SSD installed. However I don't think Inkscape pages memory to disk very much with 16GB of RAM handy. :) Or at least I'd hope not!
-C
On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 3:24 PM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: Yes, I use Unity on both computers. After installing Gnome, there's no difference, though.
Cheers, Saar. On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 1:41 PM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote: > Reinstalled Inkscape 0.91 r13725 > Can't reproduce the slowdown on my laptop, even zoomed in to 25600%. > > My system: i5-2520M @ 2.5GHz x 4 64-bit, 16GB RAM > > Ubuntu 15.10 running Gnome 3.16.4 > > Inkscape trunk does feel faster by a bit, but I'm not getting any > significant lag in 0.91 either. > > Saar, are you using Unity by chance? > > Thanks. > -C > > > On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 12:42 PM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> In this particular instance there aren't any objects with 'lots' of nodes. >> >> I'm attaching a design where the performance issued are less severe >> than the one I'm experiencing with a design I cannot share, although >> the complexity of the latter is not that much greater. They are both >> generated by the same software, so should exhibit similar 'symptoms'. >> Things get clunky when zoomed in and after a while of editing and >> zooming in and out. Hiding layers doesn't seem to make much >> difference. Maybe this could shed some light on the issue? >> >> Thanks, >> Saar. >> >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:49 AM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote: >> > I decided to quickly stress test this, making a 100 point star, >> > replicating >> > it 50 times, converting the objects to geometry, then shrinking them all >> > down to .5mm and zooming to 12800% >> > >> > Result: There is some slowdown, but not nearly as much as I was >> > expecting. >> > This is on a 4 year old laptop running Ubuntu Linux with Gnome 3. >> > >> > What does slow it down a lot more however is taking those 50 objects, >> > and >> > ctrl-k converting them to a single object. The slowdown is approximately >> > 10x >> > slower than what it was before. >> > >> > If this is what's slowing you down, my advice would be to break your >> > large >> > (in number of points) object up into multiple objects while editing, >> > then >> > recombine them when done. >> > >> > ctrl-shift-k to break apart, and ctrl+k to recombine. >> > >> > -C >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> >> >> > OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up? >> >> >> >> Just tried by removing all opacity. Doesn't make a difference. >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> Saar. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Olof Bjarnason >> >> <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote: >> >> > OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up? >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > Mvh >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > /Olof >> >> > ----------------- >> >> > 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? >> >> > Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till >> >> > Android. >> >> > https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > On 21 March 2016 at 10:43, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> Hello Olof, >> >> >> >> >> >> The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the >> >> >> settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements do, >> >> >> however, have some degree of transparency. >> >> >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> Saar. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason >> >> >> <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote: >> >> >> > Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur >> >> >> > / >> >> >> > transparency or other? >> >> >> > >> >> >> > I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming >> >> >> > in >> >> >> > paths >> >> >> > with bitmap patterns on them. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Mvh >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > /Olof >> >> >> > ----------------- >> >> >> > 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? >> >> >> > Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till >> >> >> > Android. >> >> >> > https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Hello everyone, >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing >> >> >> >> some >> >> >> >> painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share >> >> >> >> right >> >> >> >> now, >> >> >> >> sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 >> >> >> >> with >> >> >> >> an >> >> >> >> i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature >> >> >> >> that >> >> >> >> might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects >> >> >> >> that >> >> >> >> can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit >> >> >> >> boards). >> >> >> >> The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small >> >> >> >> objects; >> >> >> >> it >> >> >> >> happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and >> >> >> >> even >> >> >> >> changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such >> >> >> >> operation >> >> >> >> I >> >> >> >> get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when >> >> >> >> zoomed >> >> >> >> out >> >> >> >> is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Another thing that's happening that could be related is the >> >> >> >> following >> >> >> >> prompts keep appearing on the console: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> (inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: >> >> >> >> pango_font_family_list_faces: >> >> >> >> assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> (inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: >> >> >> >> IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: >> >> >> >> assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover >> >> >> >> if >> >> >> >> they are related to the performance problems. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've >> >> >> >> tried: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> * Running with fresh preferences.xml >> >> >> >> * Geometric bounding box >> >> >> >> * Reducing the complexity of the design >> >> >> >> * Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are >> >> >> >> relevant >> >> >> >> for the operation (usually only two layers) >> >> >> >> * Hiding rulers and scroll-bars >> >> >> >> * Maximising memory and threads (with restart) >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to >> >> >> >> recommend >> >> >> >> something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I >> >> >> >> can >> >> >> >> share so that we could work though it. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> >> Saar. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> >> >> Transform Data into Opportunity. >> >> >> >> Accelerate data analysis in your applications with >> >> >> >> Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. >> >> >> >> Click to learn more. >> >> >> >> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> >> >> Inkscape-devel mailing list >> >> >> >> Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net >> >> >> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> Transform Data into Opportunity. >> >> Accelerate data analysis in your applications with >> >> Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. >> >> Click to learn more. >> >> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785351&iu=/4140 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Inkscape-devel mailing list >> >> Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net >> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel >> > >> > > >
Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
No, that didn't work either. I'm happy to try other things... I've even tried a fresh Ubuntu (15.10) install just now. I'm kind of stuck because I cannot work on my design :(
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 4:26 PM, Martin Owens <doctormo@...400...> wrote:
Try disabling the ubuntu/unity scroll bars. They cause so many problems, maybe they cause this one too.
Martin,
On Mon, 2016-04-04 at 15:59 +0100, C R wrote:
The only other possible difference is that I have an SSD installed. However I don't think Inkscape pages memory to disk very much with 16GB of RAM handy. :) Or at least I'd hope not!
-C
On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 3:24 PM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: Yes, I use Unity on both computers. After installing Gnome, there's no difference, though.
Cheers, Saar. On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 1:41 PM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote: > Reinstalled Inkscape 0.91 r13725 > Can't reproduce the slowdown on my laptop, even zoomed in to 25600%. > > My system: i5-2520M @ 2.5GHz x 4 64-bit, 16GB RAM > > Ubuntu 15.10 running Gnome 3.16.4 > > Inkscape trunk does feel faster by a bit, but I'm not getting any > significant lag in 0.91 either. > > Saar, are you using Unity by chance? > > Thanks. > -C > > > On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 12:42 PM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> In this particular instance there aren't any objects with 'lots' of nodes. >> >> I'm attaching a design where the performance issued are less severe >> than the one I'm experiencing with a design I cannot share, although >> the complexity of the latter is not that much greater. They are both >> generated by the same software, so should exhibit similar 'symptoms'. >> Things get clunky when zoomed in and after a while of editing and >> zooming in and out. Hiding layers doesn't seem to make much >> difference. Maybe this could shed some light on the issue? >> >> Thanks, >> Saar. >> >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:49 AM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote: >> > I decided to quickly stress test this, making a 100 point star, >> > replicating >> > it 50 times, converting the objects to geometry, then shrinking them all >> > down to .5mm and zooming to 12800% >> > >> > Result: There is some slowdown, but not nearly as much as I was >> > expecting. >> > This is on a 4 year old laptop running Ubuntu Linux with Gnome 3. >> > >> > What does slow it down a lot more however is taking those 50 objects, >> > and >> > ctrl-k converting them to a single object. The slowdown is approximately >> > 10x >> > slower than what it was before. >> > >> > If this is what's slowing you down, my advice would be to break your >> > large >> > (in number of points) object up into multiple objects while editing, >> > then >> > recombine them when done. >> > >> > ctrl-shift-k to break apart, and ctrl+k to recombine. >> > >> > -C >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> >> >> > OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up? >> >> >> >> Just tried by removing all opacity. Doesn't make a difference. >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> Saar. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Olof Bjarnason >> >> <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote: >> >> > OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up? >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > Mvh >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > /Olof >> >> > ----------------- >> >> > 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? >> >> > Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till >> >> > Android. >> >> > https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > On 21 March 2016 at 10:43, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> Hello Olof, >> >> >> >> >> >> The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the >> >> >> settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements do, >> >> >> however, have some degree of transparency. >> >> >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> Saar. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason >> >> >> <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote: >> >> >> > Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur >> >> >> > / >> >> >> > transparency or other? >> >> >> > >> >> >> > I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming >> >> >> > in >> >> >> > paths >> >> >> > with bitmap patterns on them. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Mvh >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > /Olof >> >> >> > ----------------- >> >> >> > 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? >> >> >> > Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till >> >> >> > Android. >> >> >> > https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Hello everyone, >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing >> >> >> >> some >> >> >> >> painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share >> >> >> >> right >> >> >> >> now, >> >> >> >> sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 >> >> >> >> with >> >> >> >> an >> >> >> >> i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature >> >> >> >> that >> >> >> >> might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects >> >> >> >> that >> >> >> >> can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit >> >> >> >> boards). >> >> >> >> The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small >> >> >> >> objects; >> >> >> >> it >> >> >> >> happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and >> >> >> >> even >> >> >> >> changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such >> >> >> >> operation >> >> >> >> I >> >> >> >> get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when >> >> >> >> zoomed >> >> >> >> out >> >> >> >> is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Another thing that's happening that could be related is the >> >> >> >> following >> >> >> >> prompts keep appearing on the console: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> (inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: >> >> >> >> pango_font_family_list_faces: >> >> >> >> assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> (inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: >> >> >> >> IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: >> >> >> >> assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover >> >> >> >> if >> >> >> >> they are related to the performance problems. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've >> >> >> >> tried: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> * Running with fresh preferences.xml >> >> >> >> * Geometric bounding box >> >> >> >> * Reducing the complexity of the design >> >> >> >> * Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are >> >> >> >> relevant >> >> >> >> for the operation (usually only two layers) >> >> >> >> * Hiding rulers and scroll-bars >> >> >> >> * Maximising memory and threads (with restart) >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to >> >> >> >> recommend >> >> >> >> something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I >> >> >> >> can >> >> >> >> share so that we could work though it. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> >> Saar. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> >> >> Transform Data into Opportunity. >> >> >> >> Accelerate data analysis in your applications with >> >> >> >> Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. >> >> >> >> Click to learn more. >> >> >> >> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> >> >> Inkscape-devel mailing list >> >> >> >> Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net >> >> >> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> Transform Data into Opportunity. >> >> Accelerate data analysis in your applications with >> >> Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. >> >> Click to learn more. >> >> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785351&iu=/4140 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Inkscape-devel mailing list >> >> Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net >> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel >> > >> > > >
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Can record some seconds of usage that reproduces the slowness? Virtual box has builtin screen recording. On 4 Apr 2016 22:21, "Saar Drimer" <saar@...3359...> wrote:
No, that didn't work either. I'm happy to try other things... I've even tried a fresh Ubuntu (15.10) install just now. I'm kind of stuck because I cannot work on my design :(
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 4:26 PM, Martin Owens <doctormo@...400...> wrote:
Try disabling the ubuntu/unity scroll bars. They cause so many problems, maybe they cause this one too.
Martin,
On Mon, 2016-04-04 at 15:59 +0100, C R wrote:
The only other possible difference is that I have an SSD installed. However I don't think Inkscape pages memory to disk very much with 16GB of RAM handy. :) Or at least I'd hope not!
-C
On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 3:24 PM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: Yes, I use Unity on both computers. After installing Gnome, there's no difference, though.
Cheers, Saar. On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 1:41 PM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote: > Reinstalled Inkscape 0.91 r13725 > Can't reproduce the slowdown on my laptop, even zoomed in to 25600%. > > My system: i5-2520M @ 2.5GHz x 4 64-bit, 16GB RAM > > Ubuntu 15.10 running Gnome 3.16.4 > > Inkscape trunk does feel faster by a bit, but I'm not getting any > significant lag in 0.91 either. > > Saar, are you using Unity by chance? > > Thanks. > -C > > > On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 12:42 PM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> In this particular instance there aren't any objects with 'lots' of nodes. >> >> I'm attaching a design where the performance issued are less severe >> than the one I'm experiencing with a design I cannot share, although >> the complexity of the latter is not that much greater. They are both >> generated by the same software, so should exhibit similar 'symptoms'. >> Things get clunky when zoomed in and after a while of editing and >> zooming in and out. Hiding layers doesn't seem to make much >> difference. Maybe this could shed some light on the issue? >> >> Thanks, >> Saar. >> >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:49 AM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote: >> > I decided to quickly stress test this, making a 100 point star, >> > replicating >> > it 50 times, converting the objects to geometry, then shrinking them all >> > down to .5mm and zooming to 12800% >> > >> > Result: There is some slowdown, but not nearly as much as I was >> > expecting. >> > This is on a 4 year old laptop running Ubuntu Linux with Gnome 3. >> > >> > What does slow it down a lot more however is taking those 50 objects, >> > and >> > ctrl-k converting them to a single object. The slowdown is approximately >> > 10x >> > slower than what it was before. >> > >> > If this is what's slowing you down, my advice would be to break your >> > large >> > (in number of points) object up into multiple objects while editing, >> > then >> > recombine them when done. >> > >> > ctrl-shift-k to break apart, and ctrl+k to recombine. >> > >> > -C >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> >> >> > OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up? >> >> >> >> Just tried by removing all opacity. Doesn't make a difference. >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> Saar. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Olof Bjarnason >> >> <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote: >> >> > OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up? >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > Mvh >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > /Olof >> >> > ----------------- >> >> > 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? >> >> > Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till >> >> > Android. >> >> > https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > On 21 March 2016 at 10:43, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> Hello Olof, >> >> >> >> >> >> The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the >> >> >> settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements do, >> >> >> however, have some degree of transparency. >> >> >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> Saar. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason >> >> >> <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote: >> >> >> > Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur >> >> >> > / >> >> >> > transparency or other? >> >> >> > >> >> >> > I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming >> >> >> > in >> >> >> > paths >> >> >> > with bitmap patterns on them. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Mvh >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > /Olof >> >> >> > ----------------- >> >> >> > 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? >> >> >> > Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till >> >> >> > Android. >> >> >> > https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Hello everyone, >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing >> >> >> >> some >> >> >> >> painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share >> >> >> >> right >> >> >> >> now, >> >> >> >> sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 >> >> >> >> with >> >> >> >> an >> >> >> >> i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature >> >> >> >> that >> >> >> >> might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects >> >> >> >> that >> >> >> >> can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit >> >> >> >> boards). >> >> >> >> The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small >> >> >> >> objects; >> >> >> >> it >> >> >> >> happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and >> >> >> >> even >> >> >> >> changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such >> >> >> >> operation >> >> >> >> I >> >> >> >> get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when >> >> >> >> zoomed >> >> >> >> out >> >> >> >> is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Another thing that's happening that could be related is the >> >> >> >> following >> >> >> >> prompts keep appearing on the console: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> (inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: >> >> >> >> pango_font_family_list_faces: >> >> >> >> assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> (inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: >> >> >> >> IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: >> >> >> >> assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover >> >> >> >> if >> >> >> >> they are related to the performance problems. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've >> >> >> >> tried: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> * Running with fresh preferences.xml >> >> >> >> * Geometric bounding box >> >> >> >> * Reducing the complexity of the design >> >> >> >> * Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are >> >> >> >> relevant >> >> >> >> for the operation (usually only two layers) >> >> >> >> * Hiding rulers and scroll-bars >> >> >> >> * Maximising memory and threads (with restart) >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to >> >> >> >> recommend >> >> >> >> something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I >> >> >> >> can >> >> >> >> share so that we could work though it. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> >> Saar. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Transform Data into Opportunity. >> >> >> >> Accelerate data analysis in your applications with >> >> >> >> Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. >> >> >> >> Click to learn more. >> >> >> >>http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140
>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> >> >> Inkscape-devel mailing list >> >> >> >> Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net >> >> >> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>
>> >> Transform Data into Opportunity. >> >> Accelerate data analysis in your applications with >> >> Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. >> >> Click to learn more. >> >>http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785351&iu=/4140
>> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Inkscape-devel mailing list >> >> Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net >> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel >> > >> > > >
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On Mon, 2016-04-04 at 21:20 +0100, Saar Drimer wrote:
No, that didn't work either. I'm happy to try other things... I've even tried a fresh Ubuntu (15.10) install just now. I'm kind of stuck because I cannot work on my design :(
Since I'm on Ubuntu (14.04) I can give your design a go, you can send me a link privately and some instructions on what to do to cause the issue.
Martin,
Thanks Saar,
My testing here using Ubuntu 14.04 (with unity scrollbars purged) + inkscape devel ppa, i7+8GB RAM shows not speed issues as such, there's a few milliseconds of shearing as it zooms in and out but I did zooming a few hundred times with the scroll wheel very quickly without issue.
Memory usage didn't change over the tests.
So my concern is that you are experiencing issues that are much worse than a small shearing. You may have to look at your memory usage and cpu utilisation.
Sorry I couldn't be of more help other than to recommend at different physical computer to test it on.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Mon, 2016-04-04 at 12:42 +0100, Saar Drimer wrote:
In this particular instance there aren't any objects with 'lots' of nodes.
I'm attaching a design where the performance issued are less severe than the one I'm experiencing with a design I cannot share, although the complexity of the latter is not that much greater. They are both generated by the same software, so should exhibit similar 'symptoms'. Things get clunky when zoomed in and after a while of editing and zooming in and out. Hiding layers doesn't seem to make much difference. Maybe this could shed some light on the issue?
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:49 AM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote:
I decided to quickly stress test this, making a 100 point star, replicating it 50 times, converting the objects to geometry, then shrinking them all down to .5mm and zooming to 12800%
Result: There is some slowdown, but not nearly as much as I was expecting. This is on a 4 year old laptop running Ubuntu Linux with Gnome 3.
What does slow it down a lot more however is taking those 50 objects, and ctrl-k converting them to a single object. The slowdown is approximately 10x slower than what it was before.
If this is what's slowing you down, my advice would be to break your large (in number of points) object up into multiple objects while editing, then recombine them when done.
ctrl-shift-k to break apart, and ctrl+k to recombine.
-C
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Just tried by removing all opacity. Doesn't make a difference.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 10:43, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello Olof,
The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements do, however, have some degree of transparency.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur / transparency or other?
I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming in paths with bitmap patterns on them.
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: > > Hello everyone, > > I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing some > painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share > right > now, > sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 with > an > i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM. > > The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature that > might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects that > can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit > boards). > The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small objects; > it > happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and even > changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such operation > I > get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when zoomed > out > is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing. > > Another thing that's happening that could be related is the > following > prompts keep appearing on the console: > > (inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: pango_font_family_list_faces: > assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed > > (inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: > assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed > > I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover if > they are related to the performance problems. > > Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've tried: > > * Running with fresh preferences.xml > * Geometric bounding box > * Reducing the complexity of the design > * Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are relevant > for the operation (usually only two layers) > * Hiding rulers and scroll-bars > * Maximising memory and threads (with restart) > > I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to recommend > something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I can > share so that we could work though it. > > Thanks, > Saar. > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Transform Data into Opportunity. > Accelerate data analysis in your applications with > Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. > Click to learn more. > http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 > _______________________________________________ > Inkscape-devel mailing list > Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785351&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
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Progress. I found that the offending layers are top/bottom->copper->pours. This is interesting since they are layers that have lots of masks on top of a solid shapes (the 'copper pour'). Each element in the 'copper' layer creates an oversized mask copy of itself (whether there's a copper shape 'under' it) in order to create a buffer from it and the pour/solid shape. The painful slowdown goes away if I delete those two layers (hiding them doesn't make a difference).
I now have a work-around, but it would be helpful to know whether this is
1. an Inkscape issue, or 2. an issue with how I construct my SVGs (so I can resolve this on my end)
or both.
Here's an SVG that shows the masks, but doesn't show the severe slowdowns
http://wikisend.com/download/104058/tap.svg
Thanks, Saar.
On Tue, Apr 5, 2016 at 5:53 PM, Martin Owens <doctormo@...400...> wrote:
Thanks Saar,
My testing here using Ubuntu 14.04 (with unity scrollbars purged) + inkscape devel ppa, i7+8GB RAM shows not speed issues as such, there's a few milliseconds of shearing as it zooms in and out but I did zooming a few hundred times with the scroll wheel very quickly without issue.
Memory usage didn't change over the tests.
So my concern is that you are experiencing issues that are much worse than a small shearing. You may have to look at your memory usage and cpu utilisation.
Sorry I couldn't be of more help other than to recommend at different physical computer to test it on.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Mon, 2016-04-04 at 12:42 +0100, Saar Drimer wrote:
In this particular instance there aren't any objects with 'lots' of nodes.
I'm attaching a design where the performance issued are less severe than the one I'm experiencing with a design I cannot share, although the complexity of the latter is not that much greater. They are both generated by the same software, so should exhibit similar 'symptoms'. Things get clunky when zoomed in and after a while of editing and zooming in and out. Hiding layers doesn't seem to make much difference. Maybe this could shed some light on the issue?
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:49 AM, C R <cajhne@...400...> wrote:
I decided to quickly stress test this, making a 100 point star, replicating it 50 times, converting the objects to geometry, then shrinking them all down to .5mm and zooming to 12800%
Result: There is some slowdown, but not nearly as much as I was expecting. This is on a 4 year old laptop running Ubuntu Linux with Gnome 3.
What does slow it down a lot more however is taking those 50 objects, and ctrl-k converting them to a single object. The slowdown is approximately 10x slower than what it was before.
If this is what's slowing you down, my advice would be to break your large (in number of points) object up into multiple objects while editing, then recombine them when done.
ctrl-shift-k to break apart, and ctrl+k to recombine.
-C
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Just tried by removing all opacity. Doesn't make a difference.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote:
OK - Does removing transperance completely speed things up?
Mvh
/Olof
3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till Android. https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem
On 21 March 2016 at 10:43, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote:
Hello Olof,
The entire file has no effects (hence going to 'fastest' in the settings has no effect), no patterns, and no blur. Most elements do, however, have some degree of transparency.
Thanks, Saar.
On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Olof Bjarnason <olof.bjarnason@...400...> wrote: > Are you using any effects on the paths, e.g. bitmap patterns, blur / > transparency or other? > > I have also experienced severe performance problems when zooming in > paths > with bitmap patterns on them. > > > > Mvh > > > /Olof > ----------------- > 3-5-åriga småttingar i närheten? > Lek & lär siffror och bokstäver via mobilen m.h.a. Alfamem till > Android. > https://play.google.com/store/search?q=alfamem > > > On 21 March 2016 at 00:07, Saar Drimer <saar@...3359...> wrote: >> >> Hello everyone, >> >> I work with Inkscape nearly every day, but am now experiencing some >> painfully slow performance with some files (that I cannot share >> right >> now, >> sorry!) I'm working with Inkscape 0.91 r13725 on Ubuntu 15.10 with >> an >> i7-5500 and 16GB of RAM. >> >> The designs are not particularly complex, but have one feature that >> might be relevant: I'm working with dimension accurate objects that >> can be very small, 0.1mm and below (I design printed circuit >> boards). >> The slowness becomes painful when zoomed in onto the small objects; >> it >> happens when I try zooming, choosing objects, moving them, and even >> changing tools from 'node' to 'select'. nearly every such operation >> I >> get the greyed-out Ubuntu stall. Working on the design when zoomed >> out >> is not practical, but it is quite a bit faster performing. >> >> Another thing that's happening that could be related is the >> following >> prompts keep appearing on the console: >> >> (inkscape:15569): Pango-CRITICAL **: pango_font_family_list_faces: >> assertion 'PANGO_IS_FONT_FAMILY (family)' failed >> >> (inkscape:15569): Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_tree_view_scroll_to_cell: >> assertion 'tree_view->priv->tree != NULL' failed >> >> I could not find any report for how to handle these, and discover if >> they are related to the performance problems. >> >> Searching for a solution through looking at bug reports, I've tried: >> >> * Running with fresh preferences.xml >> * Geometric bounding box >> * Reducing the complexity of the design >> * Hiding layers (there are 24 layers) to only ones that are relevant >> for the operation (usually only two layers) >> * Hiding rulers and scroll-bars >> * Maximising memory and threads (with restart) >> >> I'm out of ideas, and I hope that someone might be able to recommend >> something. If there are no ideas, I'll work on a design that I can >> share so that we could work though it. >> >> Thanks, >> Saar. >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Transform Data into Opportunity. >> Accelerate data analysis in your applications with >> Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. >> Click to learn more. >> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785231&iu=/4140 >> _______________________________________________ >> Inkscape-devel mailing list >> Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel > >
Transform Data into Opportunity. Accelerate data analysis in your applications with Intel Data Analytics Acceleration Library. Click to learn more. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=278785351&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
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I have just joined the list. I have been writing software for nearly half a century - starting with Autocode on the Cambridge EDSAC 2.
I have a graphic designer wife who has grumbles about every software package she meets - usually with good reason.
Inkscape seems to have been developed by programmers looking out, rather than by artists looking in and together we may have suggestions that could improve the appeal of Inkscape to artists, especially those just discovering the power of the technology.
Best wishes John and Ros
Hi John,
please reply to all recipients.
On Wed, 6 Apr 2016 07:57:18 +1000 John Billingsley <john@...3371...> wrote:
I have just joined the list. I have been writing software for nearly half a century - starting with Autocode on the Cambridge EDSAC 2.
I have a graphic designer wife who has grumbles about every software package she meets - usually with good reason.
Inkscape seems to have been developed by programmers looking out, rather than by artists looking in and together we may have suggestions that could improve the appeal of Inkscape to artists, especially those just discovering the power of the technology.
I personally welcome all suggestions and constructive criticism, but we may have some reasons not to implement them. I don't understand what "looking out" and "looking in" mean in this context, but I know that Inkscape has been successfully used by many talented web designers to create some amazing stuff (see https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/ for instance). If you can contribute in any way, that will be even better (see http://teachingopensource.org/index.php/How_to_start_contributing_to_or_usin... ).
Finally, see http://www.shlomifish.org/philosophy/computers/netiquette/email/start-new-th... for why you should not reply to an existing message in order to start a new thread . As it stands, this message of yours is burried deep inside an unrelated thread.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
Best wishes John and Ros
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Thanks for your offer of input, John.
I'm one of the professional designers who works with the devs in the Inkscape project, and I also help with the irc chat questions quite often.
If you would please forward all your ideas to me for Inkscape changes/tweaks, etc. I can tell you how Inkscape presently handles the requested items, how we will handle them in the future (if we have plans), and also use your input and advice along with the advice of other artists who will be joining our group at LGM to talk about UX (User eXperience). I'm sure at least some of them will be covered, and more user input is always appreciated.
Thanks again!
-C
On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 8:33 AM, Shlomi Fish <shlomif@...2985...> wrote:
Hi John,
please reply to all recipients.
On Wed, 6 Apr 2016 07:57:18 +1000 John Billingsley <john@...3371...> wrote:
I have just joined the list. I have been writing software for nearly half a century - starting with Autocode on the Cambridge EDSAC 2.
I have a graphic designer wife who has grumbles about every software package she meets - usually with good reason.
Inkscape seems to have been developed by programmers looking out, rather than by artists looking in and together we may have suggestions that could improve the appeal of Inkscape to artists, especially those just discovering the power of the technology.
I personally welcome all suggestions and constructive criticism, but we may have some reasons not to implement them. I don't understand what "looking out" and "looking in" mean in this context, but I know that Inkscape has been successfully used by many talented web designers to create some amazing stuff (see https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/ for instance). If you can contribute in any way, that will be even better (see
http://teachingopensource.org/index.php/How_to_start_contributing_to_or_usin... ).
Finally, see
http://www.shlomifish.org/philosophy/computers/netiquette/email/start-new-th... for why you should not reply to an existing message in order to start a new thread . As it stands, this message of yours is burried deep inside an unrelated thread.
Regards,
Shlomi FishBest wishes John and Ros
Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
--
Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ Humanity - Parody of Modern Life - http://shlom.in/humanity
Deletionists delete Wikipedia articles that they consider lame.
Chuck Norris deletes Deletionists whom he considers lame.
Please reply to list if it's a mailing list post - http://shlom.in/reply .
Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
To some extent you have answered your own question about 'looking out' and 'looking in'. When you are living with the system, it all seems obvious. You rely on your peers to show their appreciation of your improvements, rather than the users you might be trying to attract. When you are a newcomer, unless things are spelled out clearly you are not encouraged to go on. Thanks for these instructions, now I will try to 'do the right thing'! Cheers John
On 06/04/2016 17:33, Shlomi Fish wrote:
Hi John,
please reply to all recipients.
On Wed, 6 Apr 2016 07:57:18 +1000 John Billingsley <john@...3371...> wrote:
I have just joined the list. I have been writing software for nearly half a century - starting with Autocode on the Cambridge EDSAC 2.
I have a graphic designer wife who has grumbles about every software package she meets - usually with good reason.
Inkscape seems to have been developed by programmers looking out, rather than by artists looking in and together we may have suggestions that could improve the appeal of Inkscape to artists, especially those just discovering the power of the technology.
I personally welcome all suggestions and constructive criticism, but we may have some reasons not to implement them. I don't understand what "looking out" and "looking in" mean in this context, but I know that Inkscape has been successfully used by many talented web designers to create some amazing stuff (see https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/ for instance). If you can contribute in any way, that will be even better (see http://teachingopensource.org/index.php/How_to_start_contributing_to_or_usin... ).
Finally, see http://www.shlomifish.org/philosophy/computers/netiquette/email/start-new-th... for why you should not reply to an existing message in order to start a new thread . As it stands, this message of yours is burried deep inside an unrelated thread.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
Best wishes John and Ros
Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Inkscape contains an impressive quantity of features - and that is one of its problems! My artist wife's first concern is to produce artwork, at present in the form of cartoon strips or illustrations for children's books. In order to get started on her latest projects she has been attracted by some of the simple doodling applications such as the one in OneNote, but of course to go further she needs to use vector graphics rather than bitmaps. For several decades now she has adapted to the increasing complexity of the Corel graphics suite, tolerating rather than welcoming the new features that push up the price. Inkscape can do all that Corel can do, but finding a way through the menus can be a problem.
My first suggestion is that you show a 'newcomer' option when the software is first loaded. Only three or four pen settings are offered and most of the other tools are hidden. On the basic pen, pressure changes width, rather than opacity. Instructions and hints are directed to enabling more of the features - when the user is ready for them.
Find an artist friend who knows nothing about graphics software, if you can, and watch them as they start to use Inkscape.
Best wishes John
First, I should say that I'm not a developer, but only a user of Inkscape, and only as a hobby. (Although I've been helping with the development of the website, in a non-coding way.) So I can't respond to development. But for this comment:
"> My first suggestion is that you show a 'newcomer' option when the
software is first loaded. Only three or four pen settings are offered and most of the other tools are hidden. On the basic pen, pressure changes width, rather than opacity. Instructions and hints are directed to enabling more of the features - when the user is ready for them."
The problem with that is that not all newcomers are artists, and not all artists are sketch artists (or cartoon artist). But I like the general idea. Maybe a "simple" version, with only basic tools (shapes, Pencil, Pen, Node, Zoom, Text) (maybe Dropper).
Without development skills, I'm not sure if having only certain tools installed would be a good or bad idea. When someone is ready to move beyond the basics, do they have to reinstall, and choose the "full" version? Or should there be some other way to temporarily conceal advanced tools? Maybe Inkscape could be installed normally, but there could be added some kind of visual cue about basic or advanced tools or features (like maybe icon/buttons have a thin border, around the button like rounded rectangle, not like a stroke around the icon figure). Menu items maybe are highlighted somehow, or certain text color.
However, that might be excluding key shortcuts. I don't know how it could be indicated as to whether key shortcuts are for a basic feature or an advanced feature. I typically only use buttons and menus, but I know I'm in the minority. Most people heavily use key shortcuts, in my experience. Or maybe key shortcuts would be considered entirely as advanced? And basic usage would focus on buttons and menus??
I also wanted to say that there are a few of us who have been wanting a manual that is more helpful for beginners, and perhaps even graphics novices -- one which teaches Inkscape in a step by step way. The current "official" Inkscape manual is extremely thorough, and very good for intermediate to advanced users. But newbies can't use it very well. I remember when I first started, I thought "If only I knew the proper terminology, I could find what I need in this manual." It was only after reading in forums where I learned the right terminology, and then I could start using the manual on my own.
So we may be finally on our way to starting on this project. A French team had created the first chapter of such a manual. But before it can be used as a template for a full manual, it needs to be translated to English. And that's the part that it sounds like is about to happen. Then we should probably start forming a team, and working out some kind of logistics, for the best production routine.
Anyway, do you think it would be helpful to have such a manual? Or do you think it would be better to give Inkscape something like an on-canvas tutorial?
(I wonder if this new manual could be a series of Inkscape SVG files?? Oh -- I'm very excited about that idea! Because if it were a series of Inkscape SVG files, it would be easier to have it packed with Inkscape -- another much wanted feature! Not sure if it would actually work though?)
Thanks for bringing up this subject. I hope we can keep it going, and make Inkscape more attractive to beginners.
All best, brynn
-------------------------------------------------- From: "John Billingsley" <john@...3371...> Sent: Friday, April 08, 2016 6:15 PM To: "Shlomi Fish" <shlomif@...2985...> Cc: inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; <ros@...3372...> Subject: [Inkscape-devel] Artist appeal
Inkscape contains an impressive quantity of features - and that is one of its problems! My artist wife's first concern is to produce artwork, at present in the form of cartoon strips or illustrations for children's books. In order to get started on her latest projects she has been attracted by some of the simple doodling applications such as the one in OneNote, but of course to go further she needs to use vector graphics rather than bitmaps. For several decades now she has adapted to the increasing complexity of the Corel graphics suite, tolerating rather than welcoming the new features that push up the price. Inkscape can do all that Corel can do, but finding a way through the menus can be a problem.
My first suggestion is that you show a 'newcomer' option when the software is first loaded. Only three or four pen settings are offered and most of the other tools are hidden. On the basic pen, pressure changes width, rather than opacity. Instructions and hints are directed to enabling more of the features - when the user is ready for them.
Find an artist friend who knows nothing about graphics software, if you can, and watch them as they start to use Inkscape.
Best wishes John
Find and fix application performance issues faster with Applications Manager Applications Manager provides deep performance insights into multiple tiers of your business applications. It resolves application problems quickly and reduces your MTTR. Get your free trial! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/ gampad/clk?id=1444514301&iu=/ca-pub-7940484522588532 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Just my 0.02 Euro by "gut feeling." First, a bit of background about me: graphics is not my profession. I work in the field of DSP and I use inkscape to make the pictures I use in my papers. I am not a professional programmer, but I code as part of my job (testing out new algorithms). I contributed a tiny bit to inkscape (correcting two bugs).
I like the idea of a configurable interface, maybe "profiled." Depending on your needs, you can load a specific profile that it makes it easier to reach what you use most. Although the idea is intriguing, I am afraid that it is not exactly trivial. I have almost no experience with GUIs, but I believe that it is not easy to create an easy to use interface, let it alone to develop and maintain many different interfaces. (BTW, I like the current inkscape interface)
About documentation: I learnt using inkscape by means of the tutorials. I must say (my own personal opinion, of course) that I like them: they are easy to follow, you can experiment while you read (nice idea to have them in SVG!) and they give you a very wide overview of the possibilities of inkscape. Of course, before reaching full speed you need to do some experience...
-- Riccardo Bernardini Tel : +39-0432-55-8271 skype : bernardini.riccardo LinkedIn : https://www.linkedin.com/in/riccardobernardini ________________________________________ Da: Brynn [brynn@...3133...] Inviato: sabato 9 aprile 2016 03.35 A: Shlomi Fish; John Billingsley Cc: inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; ros@...3372... Oggetto: Re: [Inkscape-devel] Artist appeal
First, I should say that I'm not a developer, but only a user of Inkscape, and only as a hobby. (Although I've been helping with the development of the website, in a non-coding way.) So I can't respond to development. But for this comment:
"> My first suggestion is that you show a 'newcomer' option when the
software is first loaded. Only three or four pen settings are offered and most of the other tools are hidden. On the basic pen, pressure changes width, rather than opacity. Instructions and hints are directed to enabling more of the features - when the user is ready for them."
The problem with that is that not all newcomers are artists, and not all artists are sketch artists (or cartoon artist). But I like the general idea. Maybe a "simple" version, with only basic tools (shapes, Pencil, Pen, Node, Zoom, Text) (maybe Dropper).
Without development skills, I'm not sure if having only certain tools installed would be a good or bad idea. When someone is ready to move beyond the basics, do they have to reinstall, and choose the "full" version? Or should there be some other way to temporarily conceal advanced tools? Maybe Inkscape could be installed normally, but there could be added some kind of visual cue about basic or advanced tools or features (like maybe icon/buttons have a thin border, around the button like rounded rectangle, not like a stroke around the icon figure). Menu items maybe are highlighted somehow, or certain text color.
However, that might be excluding key shortcuts. I don't know how it could be indicated as to whether key shortcuts are for a basic feature or an advanced feature. I typically only use buttons and menus, but I know I'm in the minority. Most people heavily use key shortcuts, in my experience. Or maybe key shortcuts would be considered entirely as advanced? And basic usage would focus on buttons and menus??
I also wanted to say that there are a few of us who have been wanting a manual that is more helpful for beginners, and perhaps even graphics novices -- one which teaches Inkscape in a step by step way. The current "official" Inkscape manual is extremely thorough, and very good for intermediate to advanced users. But newbies can't use it very well. I remember when I first started, I thought "If only I knew the proper terminology, I could find what I need in this manual." It was only after reading in forums where I learned the right terminology, and then I could start using the manual on my own.
So we may be finally on our way to starting on this project. A French team had created the first chapter of such a manual. But before it can be used as a template for a full manual, it needs to be translated to English. And that's the part that it sounds like is about to happen. Then we should probably start forming a team, and working out some kind of logistics, for the best production routine.
Anyway, do you think it would be helpful to have such a manual? Or do you think it would be better to give Inkscape something like an on-canvas tutorial?
(I wonder if this new manual could be a series of Inkscape SVG files?? Oh -- I'm very excited about that idea! Because if it were a series of Inkscape SVG files, it would be easier to have it packed with Inkscape -- another much wanted feature! Not sure if it would actually work though?)
Thanks for bringing up this subject. I hope we can keep it going, and make Inkscape more attractive to beginners.
All best, brynn
-------------------------------------------------- From: "John Billingsley" <john@...3371...> Sent: Friday, April 08, 2016 6:15 PM To: "Shlomi Fish" <shlomif@...2985...> Cc: inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; <ros@...3372...> Subject: [Inkscape-devel] Artist appeal
Inkscape contains an impressive quantity of features - and that is one of its problems! My artist wife's first concern is to produce artwork, at present in the form of cartoon strips or illustrations for children's books. In order to get started on her latest projects she has been attracted by some of the simple doodling applications such as the one in OneNote, but of course to go further she needs to use vector graphics rather than bitmaps. For several decades now she has adapted to the increasing complexity of the Corel graphics suite, tolerating rather than welcoming the new features that push up the price. Inkscape can do all that Corel can do, but finding a way through the menus can be a problem.
My first suggestion is that you show a 'newcomer' option when the software is first loaded. Only three or four pen settings are offered and most of the other tools are hidden. On the basic pen, pressure changes width, rather than opacity. Instructions and hints are directed to enabling more of the features - when the user is ready for them.
Find an artist friend who knows nothing about graphics software, if you can, and watch them as they start to use Inkscape.
Best wishes John
Find and fix application performance issues faster with Applications Manager Applications Manager provides deep performance insights into multiple tiers of your business applications. It resolves application problems quickly and reduces your MTTR. Get your free trial! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/ gampad/clk?id=1444514301&iu=/ca-pub-7940484522588532 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Find and fix application performance issues faster with Applications Manager Applications Manager provides deep performance insights into multiple tiers of your business applications. It resolves application problems quickly and reduces your MTTR. Get your free trial! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/ gampad/clk?id=1444514301&iu=/ca-pub-7940484522588532 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
I must confess that in trying to find software that appeals to my wife, I have not probed the innards of Inkscape too closely and some of my remarks concern graphics software in general. My basic suggestion is to show in the toolbar just a subset of the available tools, such subsets being selected as themes. The actual installed software would be unaffected. Of course this is not without its problems. A recent drama with her use of Corel Draw was that a theme option had been inadvertently set to 'Photoshop' so none of the controls were in the expected place!
Best wishes John
On 09/04/2016 17:08, Riccardo Bernardini wrote:
Just my 0.02 Euro by "gut feeling." First, a bit of background about me: graphics is not my profession. I work in the field of DSP and I use inkscape to make the pictures I use in my papers. I am not a professional programmer, but I code as part of my job (testing out new algorithms). I contributed a tiny bit to inkscape (correcting two bugs).
I like the idea of a configurable interface, maybe "profiled." Depending on your needs, you can load a specific profile that it makes it easier to reach what you use most. Although the idea is intriguing, I am afraid that it is not exactly trivial. I have almost no experience with GUIs, but I believe that it is not easy to create an easy to use interface, let it alone to develop and maintain many different interfaces. (BTW, I like the current inkscape interface)
About documentation: I learnt using inkscape by means of the tutorials. I must say (my own personal opinion, of course) that I like them: they are easy to follow, you can experiment while you read (nice idea to have them in SVG!) and they give you a very wide overview of the possibilities of inkscape. Of course, before reaching full speed you need to do some experience...
-- Riccardo Bernardini Tel : +39-0432-55-8271 skype : bernardini.riccardo LinkedIn : https://www.linkedin.com/in/riccardobernardini ________________________________________ Da: Brynn [brynn@...3133...] Inviato: sabato 9 aprile 2016 03.35 A: Shlomi Fish; John Billingsley Cc: inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; ros@...3372... Oggetto: Re: [Inkscape-devel] Artist appeal
First, I should say that I'm not a developer, but only a user of Inkscape, and only as a hobby. (Although I've been helping with the development of the website, in a non-coding way.) So I can't respond to development. But for this comment:
"> My first suggestion is that you show a 'newcomer' option when the
software is first loaded. Only three or four pen settings are offered and most of the other tools are hidden. On the basic pen, pressure changes width, rather than opacity. Instructions and hints are directed to enabling more of the features - when the user is ready for them."
The problem with that is that not all newcomers are artists, and not all artists are sketch artists (or cartoon artist). But I like the general idea. Maybe a "simple" version, with only basic tools (shapes, Pencil, Pen, Node, Zoom, Text) (maybe Dropper).
Without development skills, I'm not sure if having only certain tools installed would be a good or bad idea. When someone is ready to move beyond the basics, do they have to reinstall, and choose the "full" version? Or should there be some other way to temporarily conceal advanced tools? Maybe Inkscape could be installed normally, but there could be added some kind of visual cue about basic or advanced tools or features (like maybe icon/buttons have a thin border, around the button like rounded rectangle, not like a stroke around the icon figure). Menu items maybe are highlighted somehow, or certain text color.
However, that might be excluding key shortcuts. I don't know how it could be indicated as to whether key shortcuts are for a basic feature or an advanced feature. I typically only use buttons and menus, but I know I'm in the minority. Most people heavily use key shortcuts, in my experience. Or maybe key shortcuts would be considered entirely as advanced? And basic usage would focus on buttons and menus??
I also wanted to say that there are a few of us who have been wanting a manual that is more helpful for beginners, and perhaps even graphics novices -- one which teaches Inkscape in a step by step way. The current "official" Inkscape manual is extremely thorough, and very good for intermediate to advanced users. But newbies can't use it very well. I remember when I first started, I thought "If only I knew the proper terminology, I could find what I need in this manual." It was only after reading in forums where I learned the right terminology, and then I could start using the manual on my own.
So we may be finally on our way to starting on this project. A French team had created the first chapter of such a manual. But before it can be used as a template for a full manual, it needs to be translated to English. And that's the part that it sounds like is about to happen. Then we should probably start forming a team, and working out some kind of logistics, for the best production routine.
Anyway, do you think it would be helpful to have such a manual? Or do you think it would be better to give Inkscape something like an on-canvas tutorial?
(I wonder if this new manual could be a series of Inkscape SVG files?? Oh -- I'm very excited about that idea! Because if it were a series of Inkscape SVG files, it would be easier to have it packed with Inkscape -- another much wanted feature! Not sure if it would actually work though?)
Thanks for bringing up this subject. I hope we can keep it going, and make Inkscape more attractive to beginners.
All best, brynn
From: "John Billingsley" <john@...3371...> Sent: Friday, April 08, 2016 6:15 PM To: "Shlomi Fish" <shlomif@...2985...> Cc: inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; <ros@...3372...> Subject: [Inkscape-devel] Artist appeal
Inkscape contains an impressive quantity of features - and that is one of its problems! My artist wife's first concern is to produce artwork, at present in the form of cartoon strips or illustrations for children's books. In order to get started on her latest projects she has been attracted by some of the simple doodling applications such as the one in OneNote, but of course to go further she needs to use vector graphics rather than bitmaps. For several decades now she has adapted to the increasing complexity of the Corel graphics suite, tolerating rather than welcoming the new features that push up the price. Inkscape can do all that Corel can do, but finding a way through the menus can be a problem.
My first suggestion is that you show a 'newcomer' option when the software is first loaded. Only three or four pen settings are offered and most of the other tools are hidden. On the basic pen, pressure changes width, rather than opacity. Instructions and hints are directed to enabling more of the features - when the user is ready for them.
Find an artist friend who knows nothing about graphics software, if you can, and watch them as they start to use Inkscape.
Best wishes John
Find and fix application performance issues faster with Applications Manager Applications Manager provides deep performance insights into multiple tiers of your business applications. It resolves application problems quickly and reduces your MTTR. Get your free trial! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/ gampad/clk?id=1444514301&iu=/ca-pub-7940484522588532 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Find and fix application performance issues faster with Applications Manager Applications Manager provides deep performance insights into multiple tiers of your business applications. It resolves application problems quickly and reduces your MTTR. Get your free trial! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/ gampad/clk?id=1444514301&iu=/ca-pub-7940484522588532 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Find and fix application performance issues faster with Applications Manager Applications Manager provides deep performance insights into multiple tiers of your business applications. It resolves application problems quickly and reduces your MTTR. Get your free trial! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/ gampad/clk?id=1444514301&iu=/ca-pub-7940484522588532 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Of course this is not without its problems. A recent drama with her use of Corel Draw was that a theme option had been inadvertently set to 'Photoshop' so none of the controls were in the expected place!
Yes, this is why it's better to improve existing tools rather than hide them. Inkscape does not have very many tools compared to other graphics software. Adobe, for example, loves to make a tool for everything, even if the tool does essentially the same thing as others. Less tools with more controls keeps the tool pallet less cluttered.
It's often better to take a little time to use the tools and see what they do. It will save a lot of time to know shortcuts and expands what you can accomplish in Inkscape.
-C
Best wishes John
On 09/04/2016 17:08, Riccardo Bernardini wrote:
Just my 0.02 Euro by "gut feeling." First, a bit of background about
me: graphics is not my profession. I work in the field of DSP and I use inkscape to make the pictures I use in my papers. I am not a professional programmer, but I code as part of my job (testing out new algorithms). I contributed a tiny bit to inkscape (correcting two bugs).
I like the idea of a configurable interface, maybe "profiled."
Depending on your needs, you can load a specific profile that it makes it easier to reach what you use most. Although the idea is intriguing, I am afraid that it is not exactly trivial. I have almost no experience with GUIs, but I believe that it is not easy to create an easy to use interface, let it alone to develop and maintain many different interfaces. (BTW, I like the current inkscape interface)
About documentation: I learnt using inkscape by means of the
tutorials. I must say (my own personal opinion, of course) that I like them: they are easy to follow, you can experiment while you read (nice idea to have them in SVG!) and they give you a very wide overview of the possibilities of inkscape. Of course, before reaching full speed you need to do some experience...
-- Riccardo Bernardini Tel : +39-0432-55-8271 skype : bernardini.riccardo LinkedIn : https://www.linkedin.com/in/riccardobernardini ________________________________________ Da: Brynn [brynn@...3133...] Inviato: sabato 9 aprile 2016 03.35 A: Shlomi Fish; John Billingsley Cc: inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; ros@...3372... Oggetto: Re: [Inkscape-devel] Artist appeal
First, I should say that I'm not a developer, but only a user of
Inkscape,
and only as a hobby. (Although I've been helping with the development
of
the website, in a non-coding way.) So I can't respond to development.
But
for this comment:
"> My first suggestion is that you show a 'newcomer' option when the
software is first loaded. Only three or four pen settings are offered and most of the other tools are hidden. On the basic pen, pressure changes width, rather than opacity. Instructions and hints are
directed
to enabling more of the features - when the user is ready for them."
The problem with that is that not all newcomers are artists, and not all artists are sketch artists (or cartoon artist). But I like the general idea. Maybe a "simple" version, with only basic tools (shapes, Pencil,
Pen,
Node, Zoom, Text) (maybe Dropper).
Without development skills, I'm not sure if having only certain tools installed would be a good or bad idea. When someone is ready to move
beyond
the basics, do they have to reinstall, and choose the "full" version?
Or
should there be some other way to temporarily conceal advanced tools?
Maybe
Inkscape could be installed normally, but there could be added some
kind of
visual cue about basic or advanced tools or features (like maybe icon/buttons have a thin border, around the button like rounded
rectangle,
not like a stroke around the icon figure). Menu items maybe are
highlighted
somehow, or certain text color.
However, that might be excluding key shortcuts. I don't know how it
could
be indicated as to whether key shortcuts are for a basic feature or an advanced feature. I typically only use buttons and menus, but I know
I'm in
the minority. Most people heavily use key shortcuts, in my
experience. Or
maybe key shortcuts would be considered entirely as advanced? And basic usage would focus on buttons and menus??
I also wanted to say that there are a few of us who have been wanting a manual that is more helpful for beginners, and perhaps even graphics novices -- one which teaches Inkscape in a step by step way. The
current
"official" Inkscape manual is extremely thorough, and very good for intermediate to advanced users. But newbies can't use it very well. I remember when I first started, I thought "If only I knew the proper terminology, I could find what I need in this manual." It was only
after
reading in forums where I learned the right terminology, and then I
could
start using the manual on my own.
So we may be finally on our way to starting on this project. A French
team
had created the first chapter of such a manual. But before it can be
used
as a template for a full manual, it needs to be translated to English.
And
that's the part that it sounds like is about to happen. Then we should probably start forming a team, and working out some kind of logistics,
for
the best production routine.
Anyway, do you think it would be helpful to have such a manual? Or do
you
think it would be better to give Inkscape something like an on-canvas tutorial?
(I wonder if this new manual could be a series of Inkscape SVG files?? Oh -- I'm very excited about that idea! Because if it were a series
of
Inkscape SVG files, it would be easier to have it packed with Inkscape
--
another much wanted feature! Not sure if it would actually work
though?)
Thanks for bringing up this subject. I hope we can keep it going, and
make
Inkscape more attractive to beginners.
All best, brynn
From: "John Billingsley" <john@...3371...> Sent: Friday, April 08, 2016 6:15 PM To: "Shlomi Fish" <shlomif@...2985...> Cc: inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; <ros@...3372...> Subject: [Inkscape-devel] Artist appeal
Inkscape contains an impressive quantity of features - and that is one of its problems! My artist wife's first concern is to produce artwork, at present in the form of cartoon strips or illustrations for children's books. In order to get started on her latest projects she has been attracted by some of the simple doodling applications such as the one in OneNote, but of course to go further she needs to use vector graphics rather than
bitmaps.
For several decades now she has adapted to the increasing complexity of the Corel graphics suite, tolerating rather than welcoming the new features that push up the price. Inkscape can do all that Corel can
do,
but finding a way through the menus can be a problem.
My first suggestion is that you show a 'newcomer' option when the software is first loaded. Only three or four pen settings are offered and most of the other tools are hidden. On the basic pen, pressure changes width, rather than opacity. Instructions and hints are
directed
to enabling more of the features - when the user is ready for them.
Find an artist friend who knows nothing about graphics software, if you can, and watch them as they start to use Inkscape.
Best wishes John
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Hi again. Thanks for your input...
Inkscape contains an impressive quantity of features - and that is one
of its problems!
Interesting... :) Most of the features included in Inkscape are user requested features for a wide variety of different tasks. It's possible that some of them could be integrated into tool functions, but that does not necessarily cut down on the complexity of using the program.
Enabling various user modes is one option, but we would have to know a lot about the workflow of each user group before hiding tools, and settings, etc. Many tools admittedly could use better defaults, however.
My artist wife's first concern is to produce artwork, at present in the
form of cartoon strips or illustrations for children's books.
What, particularly, is getting in her way? I've been doing illustration work for a very long time, and there are few tools in Inkscape that do not benefit a professional artist. Maybe you could describe a bit more where the frustration is happening. This will allow us to see where workflow items can be streamlined, and perhaps design features which make it easier (like a wacom pen click colour and brush palate that pops up over the canvas when the pen button is clicked (like in Krita).
Of course, others may complain that these are useless features they will never use. So we face criticism from all sides when we change the UI dramatically. Which is why we have to toil a bit over changes, to find a good solution that works for our different user's needs.
In order
to get started on her latest projects she has been attracted by some of the simple doodling applications such as the one in OneNote, but of course to go further she needs to use vector graphics rather than bitmaps.
Has she tried Krita? It's made from the ground up to be for illustration work. It too is a complex program with many features, but it's presently more streamlined for working with a wacom pen tablet.
Inkscape can do all that Corel can do,
but finding a way through the menus can be a problem.
We would need specifics to consider changes. Could you provide a workflow? More specifically, the workflows that are causing her to become frustrated.
For example:
Workflow: Draw Rectangular cells for comic 1. Select Rectangle tool 2. Enable grid snapping <- Problem, grid does not match page rulers 3. Draw Rectangle <- Problem, line is too thick, now have to hunt for how to change it. Nothing is snapping yet. 4. Find the grid snapping button to enable snapping to grid <- This took me a long time to figure out. Is there an easier way? Maybe grid snapping should be enabled automatically when I turn on the grid? 5. Open Fill and Stroke dialog <- Problem, tapping twice on the tiny line colour is hard with a pen! Also, the scroll bar on the colour swatches gets in the way of clicking in the first place. 6. Decrease line width <- Problem, not easy with pen tablet alone, arrows increment by a set value, and are not affected by the zoom percentage. 7. Copy rectangle area <- This works really well! I can just hit the spacebar to duplicate! Now we are talking! Don't accidentally hold the spacebar down though! Wooah! 8. Auto arrange rectangles in a grid <- Took me a while to find the new "Arrange" dialog. Shouldn't it be in alongside the Align and Distribute options, maybe as another tab? That's instantly where I thought to look first.
Etc.
The more information you can provide, the better. I know this is a lot of tedious work, but this is what it takes for us to understand different workflows. We lean heavily on user input from all directions, and there are a lot of conflicting opinions. This is why it's very important to understand what are the actual bottlenecks in the workflow, which also lets us combine them in a functional way across different workflows to collectively solve them without creating new ones.
My first suggestion is that you show a 'newcomer' option when the
software is first loaded. Only three or four pen settings are offered and most of the other tools are hidden.
We would have to assume that the users do not wish to use certain tools. Newcomers wanting to make a simple flow-chart would not like the option hidden, for example. To hide things successfully, we would need to ask questions on startup about what the user wants to use Inkscape for, if they did not want to answer the questions (because questions are annoying when you just want to start playing), we would not be able to assume anything at all about their intended use for Inkscape.
That said, which tools would you hide? Since mousing over the tool tells you what the tool does, would it be better just to allow the user to re-arrange them to their liking? Or maybe an automated walk-through to explain the basics would work better?
On the basic pen, pressure changes width, rather than opacity. Instructions and hints are directed to enabling more of the features - when the user is ready for them.
Agree. It's a drawing tool, and all the popular ones key line width to pressure for the Calligraphic/Brush stroke tool. Since this tool is supposed to mimic a real drawing tool, this is a natural way to go... and it's in-fact the default for that tool. :)
Find an artist friend who knows nothing about graphics software, if you can, and watch them as they start to use Inkscape.
For just drawing on-canvas, the Caligraphic/Brush tool is the only real option included in Inkscape.
From an artist perspective, that's the tool we need to add more brushes to
to make Inkscape more usable for illustrators (with previews of each brush, so you don't have to guess from a drop-down list).
Thanks for your time, John!
-C
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participants (9)
-
Brynn -
C R -
John Billingsley -
Mark Schafer -
Martin Owens -
Olof Bjarnason -
Riccardo Bernardini -
Saar Drimer -
Shlomi Fish