Dear Users and Developers,
I've put together an integrated tutorial for the irc chat on inkscape.org and I'd like a few users and support contributors to give it a review:
https://inkscape.org/en/*users/chat/
You should see a few things are different now:
* You must be logged in to use the chat, previously you could be anonymous. You even must have an email configured, so facebook and twitter logins must update their user profile before chatting. * There is the above guide which add the can_irc permission to a user's account. Confirming they've seen every page (I shorted it to 4 pages). * There's a new IRC bot that offers these new commands: - webbot: whois [username] ; will tell you who a user is and a link to their website profile, in case someone joins the chat asks a question and then leaves without waiting. - webbot: tell [username] [msg] ; will send an alert to the user with a possible response. The default for website message alerts is to email them too. So you can respond to someone who just left. - Get Latest Art ; a bit of fun to return the latest item in the Artwork category on the live site. Returns the link. - If you want further integrations between irc and the website, this is now possible. (maybe good for meetings in the future)
I'm hoping these tools will allow users to feel comfortable chatting with us and also provision support contributors with what they need when in chat.
The exact text of the above tutorial is up for review here. Please let me know your suggestions by email on list.
Thanks everyone!
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Sun, Feb 07, 2016 at 03:14:13AM -0500, Martin Owens wrote:
Dear Users and Developers,
I've put together an integrated tutorial for the irc chat on inkscape.org and I'd like a few users and support contributors to give it a review:
https://inkscape.org/en/*users/chat/
You should see a few things are different now:
- You must be logged in to use the chat, previously you could be
anonymous. You even must have an email configured, so facebook and twitter logins must update their user profile before chatting.
Thanks for tackling this feature. Having to be logged in may make it less convenient but hopefully it will make everyone's experience better.
Bryce
- There is the above guide which add the can_irc permission to a user's
account. Confirming they've seen every page (I shorted it to 4 pages).
- There's a new IRC bot that offers these new commands:
- webbot: whois [username] ; will tell you who a user is and a link to
their website profile, in case someone joins the chat asks a question and then leaves without waiting.
- webbot: tell [username] [msg] ; will send an alert to the user with
a possible response. The default for website message alerts is to email them too. So you can respond to someone who just left.
- Get Latest Art ; a bit of fun to return the latest item in the
Artwork category on the live site. Returns the link.
- If you want further integrations between irc and the website, this
is now possible. (maybe good for meetings in the future)
I'm hoping these tools will allow users to feel comfortable chatting with us and also provision support contributors with what they need when in chat.
The exact text of the above tutorial is up for review here. Please let me know your suggestions by email on list.
Thanks everyone!
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Site24x7 APM Insight: Get Deep Visibility into Application Performance APM + Mobile APM + RUM: Monitor 3 App instances at just $35/Month Monitor end-to-end web transactions and take corrective actions now Troubleshoot faster and improve end-user experience. Signup Now! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=272487151&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
Hi, and sorry for the late reply.
I just wanted to say that I like the first, longer version better. The reason is that probably the people who take the time to read it are newbies and maybe even newbies to the internet. I'm afraid the abbreviated comments in the new version are too abbreviated.
Especially "Don't ask to ask". No one new to the internet will have any idea what that means. I would probably think it means -- don't ask just for the sake of asking, or in other words, have a reason for asking. And of course that's ridiculous and I wouldn't understand, so I would ignore it. And probably the first thing I would do is "ask to ask".
So the older version, which explains what each "rule" means, seems more helpful to me.
Hhmm....well I was going to give it a 2nd read, but I can't seem to open it this time. Well, as soon as I can get it open again, I'll give it another read through.
All best, brynn
-------------------------------------------------- From: "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...155...> Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2016 1:14 AM To: "inkscape-devel" inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Cc: "inkscape-user" inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: [Inkscape-user] Web Chat Review
Dear Users and Developers,
I've put together an integrated tutorial for the irc chat on inkscape.org and I'd like a few users and support contributors to give it a review:
https://inkscape.org/en/*users/chat/
You should see a few things are different now:
- You must be logged in to use the chat, previously you could be
anonymous. You even must have an email configured, so facebook and twitter logins must update their user profile before chatting.
- There is the above guide which add the can_irc permission to a user's
account. Confirming they've seen every page (I shorted it to 4 pages).
- There's a new IRC bot that offers these new commands:
- webbot: whois [username] ; will tell you who a user is and a link to
their website profile, in case someone joins the chat asks a question and then leaves without waiting.
- webbot: tell [username] [msg] ; will send an alert to the user with
a possible response. The default for website message alerts is to email them too. So you can respond to someone who just left.
- Get Latest Art ; a bit of fun to return the latest item in the
Artwork category on the live site. Returns the link.
- If you want further integrations between irc and the website, this
is now possible. (maybe good for meetings in the future)
I'm hoping these tools will allow users to feel comfortable chatting with us and also provision support contributors with what they need when in chat.
The exact text of the above tutorial is up for review here. Please let me know your suggestions by email on list.
Thanks everyone!
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Site24x7 APM Insight: Get Deep Visibility into Application Performance APM + Mobile APM + RUM: Monitor 3 App instances at just $35/Month Monitor end-to-end web transactions and take corrective actions now Troubleshoot faster and improve end-user experience. Signup Now! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=272487151&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
On Wed, 2016-02-17 at 23:24 -0700, Brynn wrote:
Hhmm....well I was going to give it a 2nd read, but I can't seem to open it this time. Well, as soon as I can get it open again, I'll give it another read through.
Thanks Brynn for the testing!
You won't be able to see it again. Once you've agreed that you've read it it disappears. Not great for review so I've put a flag in:
https://inkscape.org/en/*user/chat/?tutorial
Maybe we can expand that one page, or put some hover info items. Brynn can you put the tutorial in front of a few local people (anyone will do, young, old, no software experience etc) and we can see what kind of understanding each of the items has. If you're willing to do the experiment, you enter each response in a spreadsheet and send to me.
Are you up for it?
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Hi Martin, HA! I'll be glad to do that. I understand generally what you want. But I've never used a spreadsheet and I'm not even sure if I have a program. Could I make columns in a text editor (such as OpenOffice Writer....which I think has a new name these days..... Aahh, now is Apache OpenOffice.... whatever....) Do you mean like show it in forums? Or do you mean privately message or email it? Lol, I've been a maniac going through all my security apps, and trying to figure out how it got blocked! Well, at least that problem is solved :-D
All best, brynn
PS -- Some of my mail has not been reaching its destination this morning. Will call ISP shortly to troubleshoot, ask for explanation. But meanwhile, my mail could be slow (hopefully fixed soon).
-------------------------------------------------- From: "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...155...> Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2016 7:45 AM To: "Brynn" <brynn@...3089...> Cc: "Inkscape User Community" inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net; "inkscape-devel" inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] [Inkscape-user] Web Chat Review
On Wed, 2016-02-17 at 23:24 -0700, Brynn wrote:
Hhmm....well I was going to give it a 2nd read, but I can't seem to open it this time. Well, as soon as I can get it open again, I'll give it another read through.
Thanks Brynn for the testing!
You won't be able to see it again. Once you've agreed that you've read it it disappears. Not great for review so I've put a flag in:
https://inkscape.org/en/*user/chat/?tutorial
Maybe we can expand that one page, or put some hover info items. Brynn can you put the tutorial in front of a few local people (anyone will do, young, old, no software experience etc) and we can see what kind of understanding each of the items has. If you're willing to do the experiment, you enter each response in a spreadsheet and send to me.
Are you up for it?
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Thu, 2016-02-18 at 08:20 -0700, Brynn wrote:
Hi Martin, HA! I'll be glad to do that. I understand generally what you want. But I've never used a spreadsheet and I'm not even sure if I have a program. Could I make columns in a text editor (such as OpenOffice Writer....which I think has a new name these days..... Aahh, now is Apache OpenOffice.... whatever....)
Oh you should uninstall that and install LibreOffice instead. When Oracle bought Sun Microsystems a few years ago, the open source community trust Oracle like an oozing buboes and forked the project and created LibreOffice, Oracle having no real control over development any more dumped OpenOffice onto Apache.
LibreOffice comes with a spreadsheet program, it's like the writer's columns but it's /just/ the table and no writing part. It's very powerful, but actually quite easy, click the boxes and type stuff in them.
Do you mean like show it in forums? Or do you mean privatelymessage or email it?
Martin,
Hi Martin, Ok, will do, re OpenOffice vs LibreOffice. I don't know what "an oozing buboes" is, but it sounds dreadful. I'll try LibreOffice.
But you didn't answer:
Do you mean like show it in forums? Or do you mean privately
message or email it?
Thanks, brynn
-------------------------------------------------- From: "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...155...> Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2016 8:44 AM To: "Brynn" <brynn@...3089...> Cc: "Inkscape User Community" inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] [Inkscape-user] Web Chat Review
On Thu, 2016-02-18 at 08:20 -0700, Brynn wrote:
Hi Martin, HA! I'll be glad to do that. I understand generally what you want. But I've never used a spreadsheet and I'm not even sure if I have a program. Could I make columns in a text editor (such as OpenOffice Writer....which I think has a new name these days..... Aahh, now is Apache OpenOffice.... whatever....)
Oh you should uninstall that and install LibreOffice instead. When Oracle bought Sun Microsystems a few years ago, the open source community trust Oracle like an oozing buboes and forked the project and created LibreOffice, Oracle having no real control over development any more dumped OpenOffice onto Apache.
LibreOffice comes with a spreadsheet program, it's like the writer's columns but it's /just/ the table and no writing part. It's very powerful, but actually quite easy, click the boxes and type stuff in them.
Do you mean like show it in forums? Or do you mean privatelymessage or email it?
Martin,
Hi Martin, I never did get any response to this. Well, not about usability. The only comment was that they thought it shouldn't be required to have to click through it, to get to the chat window. Even just 1 time, they thought was too much. Sorry about that.
All best, brynn
-------------------------------------------------- From: "Brynn" <brynn@...3089...> Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2016 9:20 AM To: "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...155...> Cc: "Inkscape User Community" inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] [Inkscape-devel] Web Chat Review
Hi Martin, HA! I'll be glad to do that. I understand generally what you want. But I've never used a spreadsheet and I'm not even sure if I have a program. Could I make columns in a text editor (such as OpenOffice Writer....which I think has a new name these days..... Aahh, now is Apache OpenOffice.... whatever....) Do you mean like show it in forums? Or do you mean privately message or email it? Lol, I've been a maniac going through all my security apps, and trying to figure out how it got blocked! Well, at least that problem is solved :-D
All best, brynn
PS -- Some of my mail has not been reaching its destination this morning. Will call ISP shortly to troubleshoot, ask for explanation. But meanwhile, my mail could be slow (hopefully fixed soon).
From: "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...155...> Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2016 7:45 AM To: "Brynn" <brynn@...3089...> Cc: "Inkscape User Community" inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net; "inkscape-devel" inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] [Inkscape-user] Web Chat Review
On Wed, 2016-02-17 at 23:24 -0700, Brynn wrote:
Hhmm....well I was going to give it a 2nd read, but I can't seem to open it this time. Well, as soon as I can get it open again, I'll give it another read through.
Thanks Brynn for the testing!
You won't be able to see it again. Once you've agreed that you've read it it disappears. Not great for review so I've put a flag in:
https://inkscape.org/en/*user/chat/?tutorial
Maybe we can expand that one page, or put some hover info items. Brynn can you put the tutorial in front of a few local people (anyone will do, young, old, no software experience etc) and we can see what kind of understanding each of the items has. If you're willing to do the experiment, you enter each response in a spreadsheet and send to me.
Are you up for it?
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Site24x7 APM Insight: Get Deep Visibility into Application Performance APM + Mobile APM + RUM: Monitor 3 App instances at just $35/Month Monitor end-to-end web transactions and take corrective actions now Troubleshoot faster and improve end-user experience. Signup Now! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=272487151&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
On Wed, 2016-06-01 at 00:07 -0600, Brynn wrote:
Hi Martin, I never did get any response to this. Well, not about usability. The only comment was that they thought it shouldn't be required to have to click through it, to get to the chat window. Even just 1 time, they thought was too much. Sorry about that.
Dear Brynn,
Don't be sorry, all information is good information. The likely feedback is going to be disapproval of being /forced/ to go through the chat introduction.
But I'm happy with it's current form.
Martin,
Hi Martin, I'm ready to give the new version another read, and contact some users. However, I'm still unable to view it again. I've logged out and back in a few times, with no success. How many people did you have in mind for the survey?
Thanks, brynn
-------------------------------------------------- From: "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...155...> Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2016 7:45 AM To: "Brynn" <brynn@...3089...> Cc: "Inkscape User Community" inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net; "inkscape-devel" inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] [Inkscape-user] Web Chat Review
On Wed, 2016-02-17 at 23:24 -0700, Brynn wrote:
Hhmm....well I was going to give it a 2nd read, but I can't seem to open it this time. Well, as soon as I can get it open again, I'll give it another read through.
Thanks Brynn for the testing!
You won't be able to see it again. Once you've agreed that you've read it it disappears. Not great for review so I've put a flag in:
https://inkscape.org/en/*user/chat/?tutorial
Maybe we can expand that one page, or put some hover info items. Brynn can you put the tutorial in front of a few local people (anyone will do, young, old, no software experience etc) and we can see what kind of understanding each of the items has. If you're willing to do the experiment, you enter each response in a spreadsheet and send to me.
Are you up for it?
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Sun, 2016-02-21 at 04:00 -0700, Brynn wrote:
Hi Martin, I'm ready to give the new version another read, and contact some users. However, I'm still unable to view it again. I've logged out and back in a few times, with no success. How many people did you have in mind for the survey?
A handful should be enough, and an interesting experience :-)
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Brynn, you're right, the tutorial permission reset doesn't appear to work. I've removed it for you now, but it will only work once.
Martin will have to take a closer look.
Am 21.02.2016 um 13:29 schrieb Martin Owens:
On Sun, 2016-02-21 at 04:00 -0700, Brynn wrote:
Hi Martin, I'm ready to give the new version another read, and contact some users. However, I'm still unable to view it again. I've logged out and back in a few times, with no success. How many people did you have in mind for the survey?
A handful should be enough, and an interesting experience :-)
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Site24x7 APM Insight: Get Deep Visibility into Application Performance APM + Mobile APM + RUM: Monitor 3 App instances at just $35/Month Monitor end-to-end web transactions and take corrective actions now Troubleshoot faster and improve end-user experience. Signup Now! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=272487151&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
On Sun, 2016-02-21 at 16:58 +0100, Maren Hachmann wrote:
Brynn, you're right, the tutorial permission reset doesn't appear to work. I've removed it for you now, but it will only work once.
Martin will have to take a closer look.
To link is:
https://inkscape.org/en/*users/chat/?tutorial
Please confirm you don't see the tutorial.
Martin,
Am 21.02.2016 um 18:11 schrieb Martin Owens:
On Sun, 2016-02-21 at 16:58 +0100, Maren Hachmann wrote:
Brynn, you're right, the tutorial permission reset doesn't appear to work. I've removed it for you now, but it will only work once.
Martin will have to take a closer look.
To link is:
https://inkscape.org/en/*users/chat/?tutorial
Please confirm you don't see the tutorial.
I got a 404 all previous times I tried (3 times, making sure I didn't have the permission in between and even appending ?no_cache, all times using the link from your previous message without typing it).
Now it works. For the first page. Page 2 is already the chat, instead of the second page.
Maren
Martin,
Site24x7 APM Insight: Get Deep Visibility into Application Performance APM + Mobile APM + RUM: Monitor 3 App instances at just $35/Month Monitor end-to-end web transactions and take corrective actions now Troubleshoot faster and improve end-user experience. Signup Now! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=272487151&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
Yes, I actually see it at that link, but that is different from the first link you gave. (and not just "user" vs "users") When I try to access the first link, I got Bad Gateway on the first try. But the 2nd try, I got the tutorial.
I'll warn the testers that they can only see it once, and I'll let them know which page is last, so if they want/need, they can go back, as long as they don't click "I Understand" on the last page.
I assume that would work?
brynn
-------------------------------------------------- From: "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...155...> Sent: Sunday, February 21, 2016 10:11 AM To: "Inkscape User Community" inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] Web Chat Review
On Sun, 2016-02-21 at 16:58 +0100, Maren Hachmann wrote:
Brynn, you're right, the tutorial permission reset doesn't appear to work. I've removed it for you now, but it will only work once.
Martin will have to take a closer look.
To link is:
https://inkscape.org/en/*users/chat/?tutorial
Please confirm you don't see the tutorial.
Martin,
Site24x7 APM Insight: Get Deep Visibility into Application Performance APM + Mobile APM + RUM: Monitor 3 App instances at just $35/Month Monitor end-to-end web transactions and take corrective actions now Troubleshoot faster and improve end-user experience. Signup Now! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=272487151&iu=/4140 _______________________________________________ Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
On Sun, 2016-02-21 at 13:40 -0700, Brynn wrote:
I'll warn the testers that they can only see it once, and I'll let them know which page is last, so if they want/need, they can go back, as long as they don't click "I Understand" on the last page.
I assume that would work?
Perfect.
Sorry for the imperfection :-) and thanks for continuing.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Ok, here are comments for my 2nd look. And I'll include them in the "survey" too.
I would put the section title ("Research the Problem Before Asking", "Ask the Right People", etc.), down below in the darker purple background area. I think it's too easily passed over where it is, tucked under the main title. And since those section titles are as important as the bullet points, (because they preview the page using different words than the bullet points, which I think is helpful for understanding, esp for newbs), it's important they be read.
For the first page, make each bullet point a link to that particular resource (Link "Read the documentation" to the manual and online official tutorials; link "Search the website" to the FAQ; link "Look for tutorials" to the Tutorials page; link "Do an internet search".....well maybe there's not any reasonable place to link that to....)
And what about searching forums for a solution, before going to chat? I'm not sure if it would be appropriate for everyone, but they do contain a wealth of info ;-)
I wrote a short tutorial for my forum: "Tips to Try and Solve Your Inkscape Problems on Your Own -- Yes, Even for Beginners" It's probably a little too detailed for this chat tutorial. But just in case it might be helpful, here's the link: http://forum.inkscapecommunity.com/index.php?action=articles;sa=view;article...
For "Ask the Right People" page, the last point ("Issues must be reported to the bug tracker") needs a good deal of clarification, imo. If this tutorial is for people using chat for the first time, they're probably also new Inkscape users, and may not even have any concept of a bug tracker.
Since in reality, if a newbie happened to find a new bug, a more experienced user would likely write the bug report for them -- maybe it could be dropped??? Or at least somehow clarified so newbies aren't confused.
3rd page ("Ask Good Questions") As I said in the other message "Don't ask to ask" needs to be clarified. "Don't ask if it's ok to ask a question" ("....ask for help")
4th page ("Be Patient") Should there be something about "Say thanks" or giving some indication that the problem is solved or completed? I rarely use chat or IRC (can't type fast enough) so I don't know if it has the same problem as bb forums, where people ask a question, and then never respond, so you don't know if you answered their question or if they're just rude.
End of comments :-)
brynn
-------------------------------------------------- From: "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...155...> Sent: Sunday, February 21, 2016 2:04 PM To: "Brynn" <brynn@...3089...> Cc: "Inkscape User Community" inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] Web Chat Review
On Sun, 2016-02-21 at 13:40 -0700, Brynn wrote:
I'll warn the testers that they can only see it once, and I'll let them know which page is last, so if they want/need, they can go back, as long as they don't click "I Understand" on the last page.
I assume that would work?
Perfect.
Sorry for the imperfection :-) and thanks for continuing.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Thanks Brynn,
I've incorporated all your changes and deployed live. Please take a look and let me know if I've got everything.
thanks again for taking the time to test it.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Sun, 2016-02-21 at 19:59 -0700, Brynn wrote:
Ok, here are comments for my 2nd look. And I'll include them in the "survey" too.
I would put the section title ("Research the Problem Before Asking", "Ask the Right People", etc.), down below in the darker purple background area. I think it's too easily passed over where it is, tucked under the main title. And since those section titles are as important as the bullet points, (because they preview the page using different words than the bullet points, which I think is helpful for understanding, esp for newbs), it's important they be read.
For the first page, make each bullet point a link to that particular resource (Link "Read the documentation" to the manual and online official tutorials; link "Search the website" to the FAQ; link "Look for tutorials" to the Tutorials page; link "Do an internet search".....well maybe there's not any reasonable place to link that to....)
And what about searching forums for a solution, before going to chat? I'm not sure if it would be appropriate for everyone, but they do contain a wealth of info ;-)
I wrote a short tutorial for my forum: "Tips to Try and Solve Your Inkscape Problems on Your Own -- Yes, Even for Beginners" It's probably a little too detailed for this chat tutorial. But just in case it might be helpful, here's the link: http://forum.inkscapecommunity.com/index.php?action=articles;sa=view;article...
For "Ask the Right People" page, the last point ("Issues must be reported to the bug tracker") needs a good deal of clarification, imo. If this tutorial is for people using chat for the first time, they're probably also new Inkscape users, and may not even have any concept of a bug tracker.
Since in reality, if a newbie happened to find a new bug, a more experienced user would likely write the bug report for them -- maybe it could be dropped??? Or at least somehow clarified so newbies aren't confused.
3rd page ("Ask Good Questions") As I said in the other message "Don't ask to ask" needs to be clarified. "Don't ask if it's ok to ask a question" ("....ask for help")
4th page ("Be Patient") Should there be something about "Say thanks" or giving some indication that the problem is solved or completed? I rarely use chat or IRC (can't type fast enough) so I don't know if it has the same problem as bb forums, where people ask a question, and then never respond, so you don't know if you answered their question or if they're just rude.
End of comments :-)
brynn
From: "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...155...> Sent: Sunday, February 21, 2016 2:04 PM To: "Brynn" <brynn@...3089...> Cc: "Inkscape User Community" inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] Web Chat Review
On Sun, 2016-02-21 at 13:40 -0700, Brynn wrote:
I'll warn the testers that they can only see it once, and I'll let them know which page is last, so if they want/need, they can go back, as long as they don't click "I Understand" on the last page.
I assume that would work?
Perfect.
Sorry for the imperfection :-) and thanks for continuing.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Ok, for this link: https://inkscape.org/en/*user/chat/?tutorial, I get Page Not Found error.
For this one: https://inkscape.org/en/*users/chat/, I guess you'll have to reset it for me (again). Sorry about that.
I'll send out some requests for review today. Which link should I direct them to?
brynn
-------------------------------------------------- From: "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...155...> Sent: Monday, February 22, 2016 10:03 AM To: "Brynn" <brynn@...3089...> Cc: "Inkscape User Community" inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] Web Chat Review
Thanks Brynn,
I've incorporated all your changes and deployed live. Please take a look and let me know if I've got everything.
thanks again for taking the time to test it.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Sun, 2016-02-21 at 19:59 -0700, Brynn wrote:
Ok, here are comments for my 2nd look. And I'll include them in the "survey" too.
I would put the section title ("Research the Problem Before Asking", "Ask the Right People", etc.), down below in the darker purple background area. I think it's too easily passed over where it is, tucked under the main title. And since those section titles are as important as the bullet points, (because they preview the page using different words than the bullet points, which I think is helpful for understanding, esp for newbs), it's important they be read.
For the first page, make each bullet point a link to that particular resource (Link "Read the documentation" to the manual and online official tutorials; link "Search the website" to the FAQ; link "Look for tutorials" to the Tutorials page; link "Do an internet search".....well maybe there's not any reasonable place to link that to....)
And what about searching forums for a solution, before going to chat? I'm not sure if it would be appropriate for everyone, but they do contain a wealth of info ;-)
I wrote a short tutorial for my forum: "Tips to Try and Solve Your Inkscape Problems on Your Own -- Yes, Even for Beginners" It's probably a little too detailed for this chat tutorial. But just in case it might be helpful, here's the link: http://forum.inkscapecommunity.com/index.php?action=articles;sa=view;article...
For "Ask the Right People" page, the last point ("Issues must be reported to the bug tracker") needs a good deal of clarification, imo. If this tutorial is for people using chat for the first time, they're probably also new Inkscape users, and may not even have any concept of a bug tracker.
Since in reality, if a newbie happened to find a new bug, a more experienced user would likely write the bug report for them -- maybe it could be dropped??? Or at least somehow clarified so newbies aren't confused.
3rd page ("Ask Good Questions") As I said in the other message "Don't ask to ask" needs to be clarified. "Don't ask if it's ok to ask a question" ("....ask for help")
4th page ("Be Patient") Should there be something about "Say thanks" or giving some indication that the problem is solved or completed? I rarely use chat or IRC (can't type fast enough) so I don't know if it has the same problem as bb forums, where people ask a question, and then never respond, so you don't know if you answered their question or if they're just rude.
End of comments :-)
brynn
From: "Martin Owens" <doctormo@...155...> Sent: Sunday, February 21, 2016 2:04 PM To: "Brynn" <brynn@...3089...> Cc: "Inkscape User Community" inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] Web Chat Review
On Sun, 2016-02-21 at 13:40 -0700, Brynn wrote:
I'll warn the testers that they can only see it once, and I'll let them know which page is last, so if they want/need, they can go back, as long as they don't click "I Understand" on the last page.
I assume that would work?
Perfect.
Sorry for the imperfection :-) and thanks for continuing.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Tue, 2016-02-23 at 04:48 -0700, Brynn wrote:
Ok, for this link: https://inkscape.org/en/*user/chat/?tutorial, I get Page Not Found error.
For this one: https://inkscape.org/en/*users/chat/, I guess you'll have to reset it for me (again). Sorry about that.
Combine the two links ;-) https://inkscape.org/en/*users/chat/?tutorial
I'll send out some requests for review today. Which link should I direct them to?
Thanks Brynn,
Martin,
participants (4)
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Bryce Harrington -
Brynn -
Maren Hachmann -
Martin Owens