new forum, what happened? make a plan?
Hi Friends, As I mentioned a couple of months ago, I've lost my patience over this whole "new forum" issue.
I've been given the impression that we're (as a community) going back into limbo with the forum situation, and holding our breath that there are no more black eyes resulting from the lack of (effective) management of InkscapeForum.com.
I don't understand why. Why risk yet another black eye? Do most people just not realize everything that's happened due to the lack of effective management, over the years? Or everything that could still happen? Shall I elaborate? Or maybe most people just don't care, since they don't use forums anyway?
What yet needs to be done to make the new forum live and close the old one? To me, it has all the features it needs. As far as I know, the only thing that's still needed is load testing (lots of users at the same time).
If we can start it within 6 months, I'd like to propose that we make a concrete plan (as much as possible, given that this community doesn't function well with deadlines). Of course I'd be glad to help create such a plan.
If it requires more than 6 months more work, I would propose installing a php forum (SMF or phpBB) and start it right away. Then some day, if the Django-integrated forum is ever ready, we can switch over to it.
Thanks for any clarity on this issue.
All best, brynn
Correct if wrong, but I got the impression that it's still being worked on. I'm liaising with Doctormo, and Jabier to try and integrate the visual stylings of the new forum with our current website. If it's true that we're going back into a state of limbo do tell me so I don't do extra work for nothing! :)
Thanks. -C
On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 11:32 PM brynn <brynn@...3089...> wrote:
Hi Friends, As I mentioned a couple of months ago, I've lost my patience over this whole "new forum" issue.
I've been given the impression that we're (as a community) goingback into limbo with the forum situation, and holding our breath that there are no more black eyes resulting from the lack of (effective) management of InkscapeForum.com.
I don't understand why. Why risk yet another black eye? Do mostpeople just not realize everything that's happened due to the lack of effective management, over the years? Or everything that could still happen? Shall I elaborate? Or maybe most people just don't care, since they don't use forums anyway?
What yet needs to be done to make the new forum live and close theold one? To me, it has all the features it needs. As far as I know, the only thing that's still needed is load testing (lots of users at the same time).
If we can start it within 6 months, I'd like to propose that wemake a concrete plan (as much as possible, given that this community doesn't function well with deadlines). Of course I'd be glad to help create such a plan.
If it requires more than 6 months more work, I would proposeinstalling a php forum (SMF or phpBB) and start it right away. Then some day, if the Django-integrated forum is ever ready, we can switch over to it.
Thanks for any clarity on this issue.All best, brynn
Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
Hi Brynn,
Sorry if it seems like the website forum is in limbo, it's not. It's very functional I think on the core and has a great number of the functionalities asked for.
The questions now are so fold:
1. Do we have someone like yourself who is willing and able to doing the management work to make the new forum work? We need people who are committed being in the key seats to really get things moving.
2. The inkscape-web team is at your disposal. (or at the disposal of the management of the forum). It will from time to time appear like I get distracted easily like a dog chasing squirrels. And that appearance is entirely true. Greater use of the forum, and direction by someone in charge would greatly help keeping things focused and prioritising which of the many small paper-cuts is the most important.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Fri, 2019-01-25 at 23:41 +0000, C R wrote:
Correct if wrong, but I got the impression that it's still being worked on. I'm liaising with Doctormo, and Jabier to try and integrate the visual stylings of the new forum with our current website. If it's true that we're going back into a state of limbo do tell me so I don't do extra work for nothing! :)
Oh yes, I realize the new forum is still being worked on. I didn't mean to imply it wasn't. I just had the impression it had slowed down, and there was no longer a priority to get it open.
I was told the plan was to let the old forum keep running as long as it will, which to me, is the same limbo we've been in, for so long now. (And in my opinion, not a good idea, for what I thought would be obvious reasons.)
I'm definitely commited, but since I don't have the development skills, I don't understand what work still needs to be done. So I think it would be helpful to make a plan -- at least to have an outline of the next steps, so that everyone is on the same page.
If the folks working on the development could say what still needs to be done, I could write up tasks in a gitlab Issue (I'm not sure if there already is an issue or not, but I'll look).
And there's another potential problem that needs to be addressed as well (probably a few actually). It seems most of the membership of InkscapeForum is not interested in the new forum. When I posted the message inviting them to test it, there was little to no response. I didn't specifically address the fact that the old forum would be closed, and they didn't seem to pick up on the many hints. It sounds like they are expecting the old forum to stay open. We haven't broached that subject of closing it yet, publicly (except for this message - I'm not sure if any forum members subscribe to this list).
Plus, they somehow think I instigated the new forum, which renewed the same wild assumptions they made when I opened Inkscape Community (that I wanted to take over, or divide the forum, or steal members, or whatever nonsense they imagined).
So when the time comes to open the new forum and close the old one, that word will need to come probably from the board. In any case, I should probably no longer be "the messenger" regarding the new forum.
If you need forum management, maybe we need to work up the forum rules or guidelines (or whatever we call them)? And then we could go about setting up admins and moderators. Is that the kind of management you mean?
I'm not sure how we could use the forum any further, at this point. It seems to have been tested in every way I can think of, except for heavy traffic. I don't think it should be opened until we're ready to close the old one, for several reasons.
But if you could share your list of paper cuts which still need fixing, I could help in prioritizing them. (Maren might help too??)
If we could find a way for the board to explain that the old forum is going to be closed, the members might be more willing to test the new forum? Maybe they'd be more willing to be on the new staff too?? Here's the forum thread where I invited members to test the new forum: http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=34311 So you can see how they're resistant. I'm not sure how the best way to word it would be, but we could discuss it in real time, at some point, probably better than in email.
All best, brynn
-----Original Message----- From: doctormo@...155... Sent: Friday, January 25, 2019 6:15 PM To: Inkscape User Community Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
Hi Brynn,
Sorry if it seems like the website forum is in limbo, it's not. It's very functional I think on the core and has a great number of the functionalities asked for.
The questions now are so fold:
1. Do we have someone like yourself who is willing and able to doing the management work to make the new forum work? We need people who are committed being in the key seats to really get things moving.
2. The inkscape-web team is at your disposal. (or at the disposal of the management of the forum). It will from time to time appear like I get distracted easily like a dog chasing squirrels. And that appearance is entirely true. Greater use of the forum, and direction by someone in charge would greatly help keeping things focused and prioritising which of the many small paper-cuts is the most important.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Fri, 2019-01-25 at 23:41 +0000, C R wrote:
Correct if wrong, but I got the impression that it's still being worked on. I'm liaising with Doctormo, and Jabier to try and integrate the visual stylings of the new forum with our current website. If it's true that we're going back into a state of limbo do tell me so I don't do extra work for nothing! :)
_______________________________________________ Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
Hi Brynn,
On the subject of development: It's not still in development, slowed or stopped. It's waiting for management. Think of me as a resource to be used to help get this project off the ground, not as a manager who is driving it.
On membership: I wouldn't focus too much on the old forum, focus on building a new forum with new members. We haven't done any marketing for the new forum, haven't invited people from our other outreach areas.
I don't know who told you we should keep the forum closed until the old forum is dead. But that's a terrible strategy. The new forum is a solid base, but what it needs is a fresh population, not resentful users from previous forums.
But this is just my thoughts on membership. It's really up to the management.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Sat, 2019-01-26 at 00:02 -0700, brynn wrote:
Oh yes, I realize the new forum is still being worked on. I didn't mean to imply it wasn't. I just had the impression it had slowed down, and there was no longer a priority to get it open.
I was told the plan was to let the old forum keep running as long as it will, which to me, is the same limbo we've been in, for so long now. (And in my opinion, not a good idea, for what I thought would be obvious reasons.)
I'm definitely commited, but since I don't have the development skills, I don't understand what work still needs to be done. So I think it would be helpful to make a plan -- at least to have an outline of the next steps, so that everyone is on the same page.
If the folks working on the development could say what still needs to be done, I could write up tasks in a gitlab Issue (I'm not sure if there already is an issue or not, but I'll look).
And there's another potential problem that needs to be addressed as well (probably a few actually). It seems most of the membership of InkscapeForum is not interested in the new forum. When I posted the message inviting them to test it, there was little to no response. I didn't specifically address the fact that the old forum would be closed, and they didn't seem to pick up on the many hints. It sounds like they are expecting the old forum to stay open. We haven't broached that subject of closing it yet, publicly (except for this message - I'm not sure if any forum members subscribe to this list).
Plus, they somehow think I instigated the new forum, which renewed the same wild assumptions they made when I opened Inkscape Community (that I wanted to take over, or divide the forum, or steal members, or whatever nonsense they imagined).
So when the time comes to open the new forum and close the old one, that word will need to come probably from the board. In any case, I should probably no longer be "the messenger" regarding the new forum.
If you need forum management, maybe we need to work up the forum rules or guidelines (or whatever we call them)? And then we could go about setting up admins and moderators. Is that the kind of management you mean?
I'm not sure how we could use the forum any further, at this point. It seems to have been tested in every way I can think of, except for heavy traffic. I don't think it should be opened until we're ready to close the old one, for several reasons.
But if you could share your list of paper cuts which still need fixing, I could help in prioritizing them. (Maren might help too??)
If we could find a way for the board to explain that the old forum is going to be closed, the members might be more willing to test the new forum? Maybe they'd be more willing to be on the new staff too?? Here's the forum thread where I invited members to test the new forum: http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=34311 So you can see how they're resistant. I'm not sure how the best way to word it would be, but we could discuss it in real time, at some point, probably better than in email.
All best, brynn
-----Original Message----- From: doctormo@...155... Sent: Friday, January 25, 2019 6:15 PM To: Inkscape User Community Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
Hi Brynn,
Sorry if it seems like the website forum is in limbo, it's not. It's very functional I think on the core and has a great number of the functionalities asked for.
The questions now are so fold:
- Do we have someone like yourself who is willing and able to doing
the management work to make the new forum work? We need people who are committed being in the key seats to really get things moving.
- The inkscape-web team is at your disposal. (or at the disposal of
the management of the forum). It will from time to time appear like I get distracted easily like a dog chasing squirrels. And that appearance is entirely true. Greater use of the forum, and direction by someone in charge would greatly help keeping things focused and prioritising which of the many small paper-cuts is the most important.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Fri, 2019-01-25 at 23:41 +0000, C R wrote:
Correct if wrong, but I got the impression that it's still being worked on. I'm liaising with Doctormo, and Jabier to try and integrate the visual stylings of the new forum with our current website. If it's true that we're going back into a state of limbo do tell me so I don't do extra work for nothing! :)
Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
This echos my understanding. The new forum is supposed to attract a trickle of new members, so that there is actually incentive to make the migration for those in the old forum.
-C
On Sat, 26 Jan 2019, 16:20 <doctormo@...155... wrote:
Hi Brynn,
On the subject of development: It's not still in development, slowed or stopped. It's waiting for management. Think of me as a resource to be used to help get this project off the ground, not as a manager who is driving it.
On membership: I wouldn't focus too much on the old forum, focus on building a new forum with new members. We haven't done any marketing for the new forum, haven't invited people from our other outreach areas.
I don't know who told you we should keep the forum closed until the old forum is dead. But that's a terrible strategy. The new forum is a solid base, but what it needs is a fresh population, not resentful users from previous forums.
But this is just my thoughts on membership. It's really up to the management.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Sat, 2019-01-26 at 00:02 -0700, brynn wrote:
Oh yes, I realize the new forum is still being worked on. I didn't mean to imply it wasn't. I just had the impression it had slowed down, and there was no longer a priority to get it open.
I was told the plan was to let the old forum keep running as long as it will, which to me, is the same limbo we've been in, for so long now. (And in my opinion, not a good idea, for what I thought would be obvious reasons.)
I'm definitely commited, but since I don't have the development skills, I don't understand what work still needs to be done. So I think it would be helpful to make a plan -- at least to have an outline of the next steps, so that everyone is on the same page.
If the folks working on the development could say what still needs to be done, I could write up tasks in a gitlab Issue (I'm not sure if there already is an issue or not, but I'll look).
And there's another potential problem that needs to be addressed as well (probably a few actually). It seems most of the membership of InkscapeForum is not interested in the new forum. When I posted the message inviting them to test it, there was little to no response. I didn't specifically address the fact that the old forum would be closed, and they didn't seem to pick up on the many hints. It sounds like they are expecting the old forum to stay open. We haven't broached that subject of closing it yet, publicly (except for this message - I'm not sure if any forum members subscribe to this list).
Plus, they somehow think I instigated the new forum, which renewed the same wild assumptions they made when I opened Inkscape Community (that I wanted to take over, or divide the forum, or steal members, or whatever nonsense they imagined).
So when the time comes to open the new forum and close the old one, that word will need to come probably from the board. In any case, I should probably no longer be "the messenger" regarding the new forum.
If you need forum management, maybe we need to work up the forum rules or guidelines (or whatever we call them)? And then we could go about setting up admins and moderators. Is that the kind of management you mean?
I'm not sure how we could use the forum any further, at this point. It seems to have been tested in every way I can think of, except for heavy traffic. I don't think it should be opened until we're ready to close the old one, for several reasons.
But if you could share your list of paper cuts which still need fixing, I could help in prioritizing them. (Maren might help too??)
If we could find a way for the board to explain that the old forum is going to be closed, the members might be more willing to test the new forum? Maybe they'd be more willing to be on the new staff too?? Here's the forum thread where I invited members to test the new forum: http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=34311 So you can see how they're resistant. I'm not sure how the best way to word it would be, but we could discuss it in real time, at some point, probably better than in email.
All best, brynn
-----Original Message----- From: doctormo@...155... Sent: Friday, January 25, 2019 6:15 PM To: Inkscape User Community Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
Hi Brynn,
Sorry if it seems like the website forum is in limbo, it's not. It's very functional I think on the core and has a great number of the functionalities asked for.
The questions now are so fold:
- Do we have someone like yourself who is willing and able to doing
the management work to make the new forum work? We need people who are committed being in the key seats to really get things moving.
- The inkscape-web team is at your disposal. (or at the disposal of
the management of the forum). It will from time to time appear like I get distracted easily like a dog chasing squirrels. And that appearance is entirely true. Greater use of the forum, and direction by someone in charge would greatly help keeping things focused and prioritising which of the many small paper-cuts is the most important.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Fri, 2019-01-25 at 23:41 +0000, C R wrote:
Correct if wrong, but I got the impression that it's still being worked on. I'm liaising with Doctormo, and Jabier to try and integrate the visual stylings of the new forum with our current website. If it's true that we're going back into a state of limbo do tell me so I don't do extra work for nothing! :)
Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
Hi Martin, They didn't say it was closed. They just said it wasn't ready yet, and that there was more work to be done. And that InkscapeForum was to be left open indefinitely. To me, that's back to limbo. There was no mention of management.
On the subject of development: It's not still in development, slowed or
stopped. It's waiting for management. Think of me as a resource to be used to help get this project off the ground, not as a manager who is driving it.
Well, there are still some features, at least some that I requested, still not there yet. And I think there are some others too, that you haven't finished. Right? I know you said you had a personal list you were working from, at one time. But it still might be nice to have that list public (or did I just not find it yet?).
But it will never go anywhere as long as the old forum stays open. Believe me, I've lived that scenario for the last 5 years! Certainly not if we don't do any advertising or outreach about it. Plus, if the new one is open, and all the others are still open, I can tell you that I, for one, will not be visiting 4 forums every day. (I manage 2 myself - everyone else would have to visit 3 forums every day.)
Now, if we're going to have an official opening for the new forum, and do some outreach and advertising, (and put it in the main menu of the website), I'll be glad to reorganize and divert traffic from Inkscape Community (and Inkscape for Cutting Design), as I have always promised. But that still leaves InkscapeForum open. And as long as it's open, those people who answer questions there will not be helping in the new forum.
Oooohhhh....!! I think I just saw the light! One of the people who should definitely, most definitely, receive an announcement about the opening of a new official forum, would be the owners of the other forums. Possibly more than one announcement might be needed. But that *could* work!
Shall I re-title this (or start a new thread), and move towards forming the documentation and management for the new forum? Is anyone else on board? (We could even invite the moderators of InkscapeForum if they want to be involved, although most probably won't.)
All best, brynn
-----Original Message----- From: doctormo@...155... Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2019 9:20 AM To: Inkscape User Community Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
Hi Brynn,
On the subject of development: It's not still in development, slowed or stopped. It's waiting for management. Think of me as a resource to be used to help get this project off the ground, not as a manager who is driving it.
On membership: I wouldn't focus too much on the old forum, focus on building a new forum with new members. We haven't done any marketing for the new forum, haven't invited people from our other outreach areas.
I don't know who told you we should keep the forum closed until the old forum is dead. But that's a terrible strategy. The new forum is a solid base, but what it needs is a fresh population, not resentful users from previous forums.
But this is just my thoughts on membership. It's really up to the management.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Sat, 2019-01-26 at 00:02 -0700, brynn wrote:
Oh yes, I realize the new forum is still being worked on. I didn't mean to imply it wasn't. I just had the impression it had slowed down, and there was no longer a priority to get it open.
I was told the plan was to let the old forum keep running as long as it will, which to me, is the same limbo we've been in, for so long now. (And in my opinion, not a good idea, for what I thought would be obvious reasons.)
I'm definitely commited, but since I don't have the development skills, I don't understand what work still needs to be done. So I think it would be helpful to make a plan -- at least to have an outline of the next steps, so that everyone is on the same page.
If the folks working on the development could say what still needs to be done, I could write up tasks in a gitlab Issue (I'm not sure if there already is an issue or not, but I'll look).
And there's another potential problem that needs to be addressed as well (probably a few actually). It seems most of the membership of InkscapeForum is not interested in the new forum. When I posted the message inviting them to test it, there was little to no response. I didn't specifically address the fact that the old forum would be closed, and they didn't seem to pick up on the many hints. It sounds like they are expecting the old forum to stay open. We haven't broached that subject of closing it yet, publicly (except for this message - I'm not sure if any forum members subscribe to this list).
Plus, they somehow think I instigated the new forum, which renewed the same wild assumptions they made when I opened Inkscape Community (that I wanted to take over, or divide the forum, or steal members, or whatever nonsense they imagined).
So when the time comes to open the new forum and close the old one, that word will need to come probably from the board. In any case, I should probably no longer be "the messenger" regarding the new forum.
If you need forum management, maybe we need to work up the forum rules or guidelines (or whatever we call them)? And then we could go about setting up admins and moderators. Is that the kind of management you mean?
I'm not sure how we could use the forum any further, at this point. It seems to have been tested in every way I can think of, except for heavy traffic. I don't think it should be opened until we're ready to close the old one, for several reasons.
But if you could share your list of paper cuts which still need fixing, I could help in prioritizing them. (Maren might help too??)
If we could find a way for the board to explain that the old forum is going to be closed, the members might be more willing to test the new forum? Maybe they'd be more willing to be on the new staff too?? Here's the forum thread where I invited members to test the new forum: http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=34311 So you can see how they're resistant. I'm not sure how the best way to word it would be, but we could discuss it in real time, at some point, probably better than in email.
All best, brynn
-----Original Message----- From: doctormo@...155... Sent: Friday, January 25, 2019 6:15 PM To: Inkscape User Community Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
Hi Brynn,
Sorry if it seems like the website forum is in limbo, it's not. It's very functional I think on the core and has a great number of the functionalities asked for.
The questions now are so fold:
- Do we have someone like yourself who is willing and able to doing
the management work to make the new forum work? We need people who are committed being in the key seats to really get things moving.
- The inkscape-web team is at your disposal. (or at the disposal of
the management of the forum). It will from time to time appear like I get distracted easily like a dog chasing squirrels. And that appearance is entirely true. Greater use of the forum, and direction by someone in charge would greatly help keeping things focused and prioritising which of the many small paper-cuts is the most important.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Fri, 2019-01-25 at 23:41 +0000, C R wrote:
Correct if wrong, but I got the impression that it's still being worked on. I'm liaising with Doctormo, and Jabier to try and integrate the visual stylings of the new forum with our current website. If it's true that we're going back into a state of limbo do tell me so I don't do extra work for nothing! :)
Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
_______________________________________________ Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
On Sun, 2019-01-27 at 15:59 -0700, brynn wrote:
They didn't say it was closed. They just said it wasn'tready yet, and that there was more work to be done. And that InkscapeForum was to be left open indefinitely. To me, that's back to limbo. There was no mention of management.
Ignore them. Whoever they are. We're crossing some wires and your suggestions below about kicking off some new discussions is the right direction.
still not there yet. And I think there are some others too, that you haven't finished. Right?
Not a perfect actor. But I don't want the forum to be shuttered waiting for perfect. We have the issues list in GitLab which is the more authoritative list, but it's always going to be the case that if you were to remind me of an issue that was hitting users of the forum, I could prioritise it better.
Shall I re-title this (or start a new thread), and move towards forming the documentation and management for the new forum? Is anyone else on board? (We could even invite the moderators of InkscapeForum if they want to be involved, although most probably won't.)
Maybe we should have a vector's issue, we can talk about promoting the forum and how to do that correctly.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Ok, I'll make a new issue under Vectors team, as best I can. And then others can edit if there's a better way to format it or present it (I still get confused with the GL editor and all the codes which I don't like having to look up). (I'll reference this thread too, for completeness.)
Thanks for clearing up the situation. I really wasn't understanding the status quo correctly, apparently. Maybe no one else really did either, at least not fully.
All best, brynn
-----Original Message----- From: doctormo@...155... Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2019 10:38 PM To: Inkscape User Community Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
On Sun, 2019-01-27 at 15:59 -0700, brynn wrote:
They didn't say it was closed. They just said it wasn'tready yet, and that there was more work to be done. And that InkscapeForum was to be left open indefinitely. To me, that's back to limbo. There was no mention of management.
Ignore them. Whoever they are. We're crossing some wires and your suggestions below about kicking off some new discussions is the right direction.
still not there yet. And I think there are some others too, that you haven't finished. Right?
Not a perfect actor. But I don't want the forum to be shuttered waiting for perfect. We have the issues list in GitLab which is the more authoritative list, but it's always going to be the case that if you were to remind me of an issue that was hitting users of the forum, I could prioritise it better.
Shall I re-title this (or start a new thread), and move towards forming the documentation and management for the new forum? Is anyone else on board? (We could even invite the moderators of InkscapeForum if they want to be involved, although most probably won't.)
Maybe we should have a vector's issue, we can talk about promoting the forum and how to do that correctly.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
_______________________________________________ Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
Hhmm, I'm composing the new Issue, and I tried using @all. It's giving me a warning that I'm adding 45 people to the discussion. Should I not do that? Isn't that the whole point for using @all ??
Thanks, brynn
-----Original Message----- From: brynn Sent: Monday, January 28, 2019 12:38 AM To: Inkscape User Community Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
Ok, I'll make a new issue under Vectors team, as best I can. And then others can edit if there's a better way to format it or present it (I still get confused with the GL editor and all the codes which I don't like having to look up). (I'll reference this thread too, for completeness.)
Thanks for clearing up the situation. I really wasn't understanding the status quo correctly, apparently. Maybe no one else really did either, at least not fully.
All best, brynn
-----Original Message----- From: doctormo@...155... Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2019 10:38 PM To: Inkscape User Community Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
On Sun, 2019-01-27 at 15:59 -0700, brynn wrote:
They didn't say it was closed. They just said it wasn'tready yet, and that there was more work to be done. And that InkscapeForum was to be left open indefinitely. To me, that's back to limbo. There was no mention of management.
Ignore them. Whoever they are. We're crossing some wires and your suggestions below about kicking off some new discussions is the right direction.
still not there yet. And I think there are some others too, that you haven't finished. Right?
Not a perfect actor. But I don't want the forum to be shuttered waiting for perfect. We have the issues list in GitLab which is the more authoritative list, but it's always going to be the case that if you were to remind me of an issue that was hitting users of the forum, I could prioritise it better.
Shall I re-title this (or start a new thread), and move towards forming the documentation and management for the new forum? Is anyone else on board? (We could even invite the moderators of InkscapeForum if they want to be involved, although most probably won't.)
Maybe we should have a vector's issue, we can talk about promoting the forum and how to do that correctly.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
_______________________________________________ Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
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On Mon, 2019-01-28 at 02:43 -0700, brynn wrote:
Hhmm, I'm composing the new Issue, and I tried using @all. It's giving me a warning that I'm adding 45 people to the discussion. Should I not do that? Isn't that the whole point for using @all ??
On GitLab, I'm not sure, it's not a thing I've ever tried to use. You can probably just add Ryan, me and yourself for the GitLab issue.
If you want to use @all in rocket chat, I think that's a better place for @all to be used. (I think they're different)
Best Regards, Martin Owens
use @inkscape/vectors instead, if you want to address all vectors.
(and yes, I'm also not going to visit yet another forum - there are 6 already on my list - I'm waiting for the main forum to close first. I also don't think the of one on the website as a serious alternative to a proper forum in its current state.)
Maren
Am 28.01.19 um 11:24 schrieb doctormo@...155...:
On Mon, 2019-01-28 at 02:43 -0700, brynn wrote:
Hhmm, I'm composing the new Issue, and I tried using @all. It's giving me a warning that I'm adding 45 people to the discussion. Should I not do that? Isn't that the whole point for using @all ??
On GitLab, I'm not sure, it's not a thing I've ever tried to use. You can probably just add Ryan, me and yourself for the GitLab issue.
If you want to use @all in rocket chat, I think that's a better place for @all to be used. (I think they're different)
Best Regards, Martin Owens
Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
as a very casual visitor to forums such as this, I have only one comment to make: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_principle The site, at a first glance, is over-designed, intimidating...
Alvin
-- Sent from: http://inkscape.13.x6.nabble.com/Inkscape-User-f2857977.html
I'm not sure which forum you're referring to. But the new one has the fewest features of all of them. It does currently have many boards which aren't being used (and that gallery archive board which I still don't understand), but I would not expect most of them to remain, once we have the staff set up to make decisions.
brynn
-----Original Message----- From: alvinpenner Sent: Monday, January 28, 2019 7:08 AM To: inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
as a very casual visitor to forums such as this, I have only one comment to make: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_principle The site, at a first glance, is over-designed, intimidating...
Alvin
-- Sent from: http://inkscape.13.x6.nabble.com/Inkscape-User-f2857977.html
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I was referring to https://inkscape.org/forums/ . I saw a screen that looked like this: forums.png http://inkscape.13.x6.nabble.com/file/t148043/forums.png It had many more items than I had expected to see.
I spent a few minutes browsing the various items but was not able to figure out what their purpose was.
Alvin
-- Sent from: http://inkscape.13.x6.nabble.com/Inkscape-User-f2857977.html
Hi Alvin,
Most of those are example forums. It's likely we'll have a much smaller list, but they are a) to be decided and b) can be switched on and off in the admin interface as needed.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Wed, 2019-01-30 at 21:36 -0700, alvinpenner wrote:
I was referring to https://inkscape.org/forums/ . I saw a screen that looked like this: forums.png http://inkscape.13.x6.nabble.com/file/t148043/forums.png It had many more items than I had expected to see.
I spent a few minutes browsing the various items but was not able to figure out what their purpose was.
Alvin
-- Sent from: http://inkscape.13.x6.nabble.com/Inkscape-User-f2857977.html
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Oh yeah, those won't be permanent. They're just examples. Really what you'll see there, when the forum is ready to open, will be boards like you see on either InkscapeForum.com index page, or Inkscape Community forum index page.
Plus, I've made a suggestion to re-do that front page, so that it looks more like traditional forums. It hasn't been decided exactly what will happen, but for sure, those boards will be more like in the other 2 forums.
brynn
-----Original Message----- From: alvinpenner Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2019 9:36 PM To: inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
I was referring to https://inkscape.org/forums/ . I saw a screen that looked like this: forums.png http://inkscape.13.x6.nabble.com/file/t148043/forums.png It had many more items than I had expected to see.
I spent a few minutes browsing the various items but was not able to figure out what their purpose was.
Alvin
-- Sent from: http://inkscape.13.x6.nabble.com/Inkscape-User-f2857977.html
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okay, thanks, that is good to know.
Alvin
-- Sent from: http://inkscape.13.x6.nabble.com/Inkscape-User-f2857977.html
It's inaccurate and unfair to characterize current inkscapeforum.com forum members as resentful, just because they are reluctant to move to a new, unproven forum. Although, they might easily become resentful if they are whitewashed as malcontents for just being cautious.
Comments above in this discussion indicate that a phpbb forum is a viable fallback... why not *start* with a working, familiar, platform that has experienced worldwide users/moderators/developers? (A separate login from inkscape.org has not been a problem at the inkscapeforum.com forum, so it is a weak argument to say it is a significant obstacle for a new forum.) If the project installed a phpbb forum structured in the same manner & functionality as the current inkscapeforum.com, most active members would be amenable to moving. I certainly would. (Additional benefit would be the seamless integration of the old forum content, in the unlikely event the databases are provided.) I don't see the overarching need to reinvent the wheel.
Current active users are vital to the success of a new forum. They attract new members by providing substantive contributions. Case in point, last year there were over 1700 users on the inkscapeforum.com in a *single day*... that's about as many users as inkscapecommunity.com has registered in *five years*. I'm not saying the information at inkscapecommunity.com is inferior, but rather imagine if it had attracted more of the active group of users from inkscapeforum.com. As an active contributor of inkscapeforum.com, I can attest to >2200 posts, local folders reflecting assistance to >600 unique users, dropbox folders containing uploads of gif, svg, screenshots, for about 300 unique users... And I'm a relative lightweight compared to some other active users.
The active users are participating at high levels for the love of Inkscape and its users. These are the anchors of the user community that attract and support new users. It might be wise to listen to what they have to say... not just in their comments, but in their reluctance to move away from what is currently working.
TL;DR Don't brand us as resentful just because we are comfortable staying with a working platform. It's not resentment keeping active users at the old forum, it's functionality. When the new forum works as well or better than the current forum, active users like myself will be more open to moving.
Have a nice day. TD
On Thu, Jan 31, 2019 at 5:21 AM alvinpenner <penner@...2467...> wrote:
okay, thanks, that is good to know.
Alvin
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Hi Martin, They didn't say it was closed. They just said it wasn't ready yet, and that there was more work to be done. And that InkscapeForum was to be left open indefinitely. To me, that's back to limbo. There was no mention of management.
On the subject of development: It's not still in development, slowed or
stopped. It's waiting for management. Think of me as a resource to be used to help get this project off the ground, not as a manager who is driving it.
Well, there are still some features, at least some that I requested, still not there yet. And I think there are some others too, that you haven't finished. Right? I know you said you had a personal list you were working from, at one time. But it still might be nice to have that list public (or did I just not find it yet?).
But it will never go anywhere as long as the old forum stays open. Believe me, I've lived that scenario for the last 5 years! Certainly not if we don't do any advertising or outreach about it. Plus, if the new one is open, and all the others are still open, I can tell you that I, for one, will not be visiting 4 forums every day. (I manage 2 myself - everyone else would have to visit 3 forums every day.)
Now, if we're going to have an official opening for the new forum, and do some outreach and advertising, (and put it in the main menu of the website), I'll be glad to reorganize and divert traffic from Inkscape Community (and Inkscape for Cutting Design), as I have always promised. But that still leaves InkscapeForum open. And as long as it's open, those people who answer questions there will not be helping in the new forum.
Oooohhhh....!! I think I just saw the light! One of the people who should definitely, most definitely, receive an announcement about the opening of a new official forum, would be the owners of the other forums. Possibly more than one announcement might be needed. But that *could* work!
Shall I re-title this (or start a new thread), and move towards forming the documentation and management for the new forum? Is anyone else on board? (We could even invite the moderators of InkscapeForum if they want to be involved, although most probably won't.)
All best, brynn
-----Original Message----- From: doctormo@...155... Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2019 9:20 AM To: Inkscape User Community Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
Hi Brynn,
On the subject of development: It's not still in development, slowed or stopped. It's waiting for management. Think of me as a resource to be used to help get this project off the ground, not as a manager who is driving it.
On membership: I wouldn't focus too much on the old forum, focus on building a new forum with new members. We haven't done any marketing for the new forum, haven't invited people from our other outreach areas.
I don't know who told you we should keep the forum closed until the old forum is dead. But that's a terrible strategy. The new forum is a solid base, but what it needs is a fresh population, not resentful users from previous forums.
But this is just my thoughts on membership. It's really up to the management.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Sat, 2019-01-26 at 00:02 -0700, brynn wrote:
Oh yes, I realize the new forum is still being worked on. I didn't mean to imply it wasn't. I just had the impression it had slowed down, and there was no longer a priority to get it open.
I was told the plan was to let the old forum keep running as long as it will, which to me, is the same limbo we've been in, for so long now. (And in my opinion, not a good idea, for what I thought would be obvious reasons.)
I'm definitely commited, but since I don't have the development skills, I don't understand what work still needs to be done. So I think it would be helpful to make a plan -- at least to have an outline of the next steps, so that everyone is on the same page.
If the folks working on the development could say what still needs to be done, I could write up tasks in a gitlab Issue (I'm not sure if there already is an issue or not, but I'll look).
And there's another potential problem that needs to be addressed as well (probably a few actually). It seems most of the membership of InkscapeForum is not interested in the new forum. When I posted the message inviting them to test it, there was little to no response. I didn't specifically address the fact that the old forum would be closed, and they didn't seem to pick up on the many hints. It sounds like they are expecting the old forum to stay open. We haven't broached that subject of closing it yet, publicly (except for this message - I'm not sure if any forum members subscribe to this list).
Plus, they somehow think I instigated the new forum, which renewed the same wild assumptions they made when I opened Inkscape Community (that I wanted to take over, or divide the forum, or steal members, or whatever nonsense they imagined).
So when the time comes to open the new forum and close the old one, that word will need to come probably from the board. In any case, I should probably no longer be "the messenger" regarding the new forum.
If you need forum management, maybe we need to work up the forum rules or guidelines (or whatever we call them)? And then we could go about setting up admins and moderators. Is that the kind of management you mean?
I'm not sure how we could use the forum any further, at this point. It seems to have been tested in every way I can think of, except for heavy traffic. I don't think it should be opened until we're ready to close the old one, for several reasons.
But if you could share your list of paper cuts which still need fixing, I could help in prioritizing them. (Maren might help too??)
If we could find a way for the board to explain that the old forum is going to be closed, the members might be more willing to test the new forum? Maybe they'd be more willing to be on the new staff too?? Here's the forum thread where I invited members to test the new forum: http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=34311 So you can see how they're resistant. I'm not sure how the best way to word it would be, but we could discuss it in real time, at some point, probably better than in email.
All best, brynn
-----Original Message----- From: doctormo@...155... Sent: Friday, January 25, 2019 6:15 PM To: Inkscape User Community Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
Hi Brynn,
Sorry if it seems like the website forum is in limbo, it's not. It's very functional I think on the core and has a great number of the functionalities asked for.
The questions now are so fold:
- Do we have someone like yourself who is willing and able to doing
the management work to make the new forum work? We need people who are committed being in the key seats to really get things moving.
- The inkscape-web team is at your disposal. (or at the disposal of
the management of the forum). It will from time to time appear like I get distracted easily like a dog chasing squirrels. And that appearance is entirely true. Greater use of the forum, and direction by someone in charge would greatly help keeping things focused and prioritising which of the many small paper-cuts is the most important.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Fri, 2019-01-25 at 23:41 +0000, C R wrote:
Correct if wrong, but I got the impression that it's still being worked on. I'm liaising with Doctormo, and Jabier to try and integrate the visual stylings of the new forum with our current website. If it's true that we're going back into a state of limbo do tell me so I don't do extra work for nothing! :)
It's inaccurate and unfair to characterize current inkscapeforum.com forum members as resentful, just because they are reluctant to move to a new, unproven forum. Although, they might easily become resentful if they are whitewashed as malcontents for just being cautious.
We didn't characterize them as resentful. We said we want to prevent them from becoming resentful. (At least I did, although I don't think it was in this thread.) We certainly didn't characterize them as malcontents!
We're trying to find the best way to do this, but there's absolutely no way to find a solution that's perfect for everyone. So we have to find the way that satisfies as many people as possible. Individually, we will all get some things that we want, and we will all, not get some things that we want.
I think our biggest obstacle is lack of involvement by the people whom we don't want to become resentful. We have been trying.
I also think that a mature, fully featured forum software would be the best case scenario. But working within a community, as I said in the forum thread, we have to compromise. That's what it means to be part of a community, in my experience.
If the project could find a qualified sysadmin, who could handle a php forum on the server side, it might be a different story. (They also need to know Ansible.) But as things are now, we don't have anyone who is well-versed with php. To my understanding, that's why we're working towards the Django-integrated solution. But I don't think finding a sysadmin is anywhere near the top of the priority list right now (not now that the push towards version 1.0 has started, and with 2 hackfests coming up).
Could we install a php forum anyway? Yes. Then what happens when the next PHP upgrade comes along? Or some other changes on the server are needed, related to php? The current web admin might not be able to handle it properly (in this case probably not).
At least, that's how I understand the situation, given my not-so-tech-savvy perspective.
In any case, I repeat. We are trying to find a way to do this, that works for everyone as much as possible, and to prevent people from becoming resentful. But it's a hard road to go, when most of those people don't want to participate. We would love to hear from more InkscapeForum members!
All best, brynn
PS - tl;dr
Case in point, last year there were over 1700 users on the inkscapeforum.com in a *single day*... that's about as many users as inkscapecommunity.com has registered in *five years*.
That's not a fair comparison! First of all, you're comparing apples to oranges. Second and most importantly, InkscapeForum.com has almost a complete lack of spam control currently. (I mean programatically, not by moderation.) As far as I know, all they have is a lame captcha, which bots can solve. ("are you a bot?") Virtually everyone who visits can register.
"Users" is everyone who visits, it's not new members and not logged in members. It's visitors. After the last couple of years with little to no spam control (programatically) the site has probably become a magnet for bots. A couple of automated bots could easily rack up 1700 visits in a day!
If you compare how many register to how many actually post a message, that might be an insightful comparison. At least it weeds out free floating spammers. And Inkscape Community probably has at least an equal percentage, and probably higher. Regardless of registration, I think we handle an equal number of new messages, on average.
I'm not sure why you felt a need to say that. I've always avoided comparing the forums. But I had to clear up the meaning of those stats. In the future, I hope we can avoid comparing them, and try to work towards combining them into one new forum, which is even better than the 2 current forums combined. That's my goal, in any case.
brynn
PPS - If there are any further comparisons of the 2 forums, I won't be responding. As I've said from the beginning, I want to see the 2 forums working side by side to provide support for Inkscape and not competing. At least until the new forum opens, when Inkscape Community will be drastically reorganized, and traffic diverted to the new forum (as I have promised all along).
-----Original Message----- From: Tyler Durden Sent: Friday, February 01, 2019 9:27 AM To: Inkscape User Community Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
It's inaccurate and unfair to characterize current inkscapeforum.com forum members as resentful, just because they are reluctant to move to a new, unproven forum. Although, they might easily become resentful if they are whitewashed as malcontents for just being cautious.
Comments above in this discussion indicate that a phpbb forum is a viable fallback... why not *start* with a working, familiar, platform that has experienced worldwide users/moderators/developers? (A separate login from inkscape.org has not been a problem at the inkscapeforum.com forum, so it is a weak argument to say it is a significant obstacle for a new forum.) If the project installed a phpbb forum structured in the same manner & functionality as the current inkscapeforum.com, most active members would be amenable to moving. I certainly would. (Additional benefit would be the seamless integration of the old forum content, in the unlikely event the databases are provided.) I don't see the overarching need to reinvent the wheel.
Current active users are vital to the success of a new forum. They attract new members by providing substantive contributions. Case in point, last year there were over 1700 users on the inkscapeforum.com in a *single day*... that's about as many users as inkscapecommunity.com has registered in *five years*. I'm not saying the information at inkscapecommunity.com is inferior, but rather imagine if it had attracted more of the active group of users from inkscapeforum.com. As an active contributor of inkscapeforum.com, I can attest to >2200 posts, local folders reflecting assistance to >600 unique users, dropbox folders containing uploads of gif, svg, screenshots, for about 300 unique users... And I'm a relative lightweight compared to some other active users.
The active users are participating at high levels for the love of Inkscape and its users. These are the anchors of the user community that attract and support new users. It might be wise to listen to what they have to say... not just in their comments, but in their reluctance to move away from what is currently working.
TL;DR Don't brand us as resentful just because we are comfortable staying with a working platform. It's not resentment keeping active users at the old forum, it's functionality. When the new forum works as well or better than the current forum, active users like myself will be more open to moving.
Have a nice day. TD
Thanks Tyler for the insightful position on the new forum and the users of the old.
The Inkscape project itself (as a consensus) doesn't hold any particular views on the old forum users or any of the community run forums (there are many others). We have a desire to make sure that there is an Inkscape forum we can point users to and this has common cause with some risks to the old forum; we were brought fair evidence that the infrastructure under inkscapeforum is at a small risk of being turned off and a medium risk of under-maintenance leading to security and other issues.
The new forum project isn't a replacement, because we don't intend to change the DNS for the old forum even when the new one is up and running. We'd probably only do that in the event the old forum disappeared. Or if there was a reasonable amount of consensus from the users of the old forum.
My own bias is that I'm a python programmer and the only long active admin for the website. I made the new django forum. We get a couple of things from using this: a. some integration b. CDN for all uploaded media files c. Existing server infrastructure (search indexing, emails, etc). What we don't have for a phpbb solution, is anyone to set it up, anyone to run it and we have limited donated VPS services which this would take up. I've invited people to lead a phpbb forum project anyway, no one wanted to. So I spent time doing things that I could do to help solve the problem.
Let me know if you have any questions about the forum. There may come a day when users of the old forum need a new home and it'd be good if we got some of the big stuff fixed at this early stage.
Thanks for you help and context.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
On Fri, 2019-02-01 at 11:27 -0500, Tyler Durden wrote:
Don't brand us as resentful just because we are comfortable staying with a working platform. It's not resentment keeping active users at the old forum, it's functionality. When the new forum works as well or better than the current forum, active users like myself will be more open to moving.
Thanks for the info. I guess I'll skip the @. I'm sure I had seen @all used on gitlab before, but I'll just stick with plain English for now.
Maren, read my proposal when I post it in a few minutes. I think it should work. And if we run into problems with the new forum, we can always switch over to a php software later.
People seem to be avoiding closing of InkscapeForum. I think there would be some way to do it without creating resentment. But I also think we can let someone else do it. Oh wait, let me just post it now, and I'll put a link here.
https://gitlab.com/inkscape/vectors/general/issues/97
brynn
-----Original Message----- From: Maren Hachmann Sent: Monday, January 28, 2019 5:56 AM To: inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
use @inkscape/vectors instead, if you want to address all vectors.
(and yes, I'm also not going to visit yet another forum - there are 6 already on my list - I'm waiting for the main forum to close first. I also don't think the of one on the website as a serious alternative to a proper forum in its current state.)
Maren
Am 28.01.19 um 11:24 schrieb doctormo@...155...:
On Mon, 2019-01-28 at 02:43 -0700, brynn wrote:
Hhmm, I'm composing the new Issue, and I tried using @all. It's giving me a warning that I'm adding 45 people to the discussion. Should I not do that? Isn't that the whole point for using @all ??
On GitLab, I'm not sure, it's not a thing I've ever tried to use. You can probably just add Ryan, me and yourself for the GitLab issue.
If you want to use @all in rocket chat, I think that's a better place for @all to be used. (I think they're different)
Best Regards, Martin Owens
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On Mon, 2019-01-28 at 13:56 +0100, Maren Hachmann wrote:
I also don't think the of one on the website as a serious alternative to a proper forum in its current state.
Your loaded criticism is just wrong. The forum is serious, a fine alternative and a proper forum. It's current state is good, but not perfect.
I have checked it's design and functionality with multiple normal people. None have had any issues. Remaining issues are so many levels deep that I'm confident we'll be able to prioritise these paper-cuts with more users using the site.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
I think that comparing the new forum to other forum software, such as SMF or phpBB - well, there's really no comparison. Those are fully featured forum wares which have been developed over many, many years, and are quite sophisticated. They provide every feature which anyone wanting to run a forum might ever want or need. (with emphasis on "might ever")
But do we really need every feature? If we look the history of the old forum and at only the features which members actually use, and depend on day to day, the "new" forum has all those features. (as much as the 3 of us have been able to remember). I don't think our community needs all of them - at least we never have needed them yet.
I don't see any reason not to give the new forum a try. If after some time (5 days or 5 years), we realize there's a need for some new feature, and for some reason it can't be added, all those sophisticated wares will still be available for us. We can always switch over to one of them.
Well anyway, that's my perspective.
brynn
-----Original Message----- From: doctormo@...155... Sent: Monday, January 28, 2019 10:17 AM To: Inkscape User Community Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] new forum, what happened? make a plan?
On Mon, 2019-01-28 at 13:56 +0100, Maren Hachmann wrote:
I also don't think the of one on the website as a serious alternative to a proper forum in its current state.
Your loaded criticism is just wrong. The forum is serious, a fine alternative and a proper forum. It's current state is good, but not perfect.
I have checked it's design and functionality with multiple normal people. None have had any issues. Remaining issues are so many levels deep that I'm confident we'll be able to prioritise these paper-cuts with more users using the site.
Best Regards, Martin Owens
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Brynn, Go ahead and do what needs to be done. You will never make all of the people happy. Best Regards, Bill
Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ On Friday, January 25, 2019 5:31 PM, brynn <brynn@...3089...> wrote:
Hi Friends, As I mentioned a couple of months ago, I've lost my patience over this whole "new forum" issue.
I've been given the impression that we're (as a community) going back into limbo with the forum situation, and holding our breath that there are no more black eyes resulting from the lack of (effective) management of InkscapeForum.com.
I don't understand why. Why risk yet another black eye? Do most people just not realize everything that's happened due to the lack of effective management, over the years? Or everything that could still happen? Shall I elaborate? Or maybe most people just don't care, since they don't use forums anyway?
What yet needs to be done to make the new forum live and close the old one? To me, it has all the features it needs. As far as I know, the only thing that's still needed is load testing (lots of users at the same time).
If we can start it within 6 months, I'd like to propose that we make a concrete plan (as much as possible, given that this community doesn't function well with deadlines). Of course I'd be glad to help create such a plan.
If it requires more than 6 months more work, I would propose installing a php forum (SMF or phpBB) and start it right away. Then some day, if the Django-integrated forum is ever ready, we can switch over to it.
Thanks for any clarity on this issue.
All best, brynn
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alvinpenner -
Bill Sherwood -
brynn -
C R -
Marc Jeanmougin -
Maren Hachmann -
Tyler Durden