stroke tracing CAD data (for black-and-white line illustration)?
I am working in the manufacturing industry. SolidWorks is part of the tools available for technical illustration.
Therefore I´m very keen on finding a way of passing geometric CAD data (just line drawings) into Inkscape.
Via DXF2SVG: I first tried to import a converted dxf. However the files are to big for Inkscape, it crashes when trying to import more around 500 objects.
Via Tracing: I tried to get around this problem by tracing the technical line drawing. But then again it resulted in about 400 single objects and 3000 nodes, Inkscape gets very very slow or even crashes.
Is it possible to generate a stroke tracing. Generating just a single stroke instead of multitudes of objects or surfaces?
Would be intresting to see if there are more users out there who are trying to pass CAD Data into Inkscape and use it for black-and-white line illustrations. I´ve been watching this mailing list for a while and I do get the impression Inkscape is mainly developed for art work, webdesign etc.. However passing geometric CAD data into Inksape is probably not an issue for the Inkcape users. (Hopefully I am wrong there).
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I've used Inkscape with vectorizations well in the range of the (early) tenths of thousands of nodes without crashing. Admiteddly, it gets slow, but then you have to do a bit of cleansing work. It's true that Inkscape renderization could be faster.
I think is also true that, at the moment, Inkscape is more ready for 'artistic' work than technical one. And size of images is not the only limitation... I think that Inkscape has issues with units and accurate placement of items, too? (I'm just blabbling here, so ignore me if I am wrong).
Could you pass us one of your CAD files, to experiment with it?
What exactly do you want to do with the imported CAD in Inkscape? Put it pretty for showcase printing, or something technical?
Denís.
Marcel.Tippmann@...2272... wrote:
I am working in the manufacturing industry. SolidWorks is part of the tools available for technical illustration.
Therefore I´m very keen on finding a way of passing geometric CAD data (just line drawings) into Inkscape.
Via DXF2SVG: I first tried to import a converted dxf. However the files are to big for Inkscape, it crashes when trying to import more around 500 objects.
Via Tracing: I tried to get around this problem by tracing the technical line drawing. But then again it resulted in about 400 single objects and 3000 nodes, Inkscape gets very very slow or even crashes.
Is it possible to generate a stroke tracing. Generating just a single stroke instead of multitudes of objects or surfaces?
Would be intresting to see if there are more users out there who are trying to pass CAD Data into Inkscape and use it for black-and-white line illustrations. I´ve been watching this mailing list for a while and I do get the impression Inkscape is mainly developed for art work, webdesign etc.. However passing geometric CAD data into Inksape is probably not an issue for the Inkcape users. (Hopefully I am wrong there).
Lindauer DORNIER GmbH Rickenbacher Str. 119 88129 Lindau / Germany Phone: +49 8382 703-0 Fax: +49 8382 703-4 15 webmaster@...2272... http://www.lindauerdornier.com
Commercial Registry: HR Kempten Nr. B/1220
Chairman of the Supervisory Board: Prof. Dr. Dieter Feddersen, Managing Directors: Peter D. Dornier (CEO), Michael Ebeling, Dr. Andreas Rutz, Hans-Jürgen Schmidt (CFO)
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Denis Fernandes - inkscape-user-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net schrieb am 08.06.2007 11:18:26:
What exactly do you want to do with the imported CAD in Inkscape? Put it
pretty for showcase printing, or something technical?
here I give you some more detailed example on how I would like to combine CAD-data with Inkscape:
In my case I draw black-and-white line illustrations for instruction manuals (weaving machines).
Since I do have together with our engeneers direct access to our 3D SolidWorks Database, I can load the 3D Model directly on my Computer. I´ll then rotate the model to a view that I need (mostly some kind of isometric view). I then export the given view as a CAD file such as dxf (see picture). I now have the accurate lines within a dxf-file. However the CAD-system is not suitable or flexible enough to produce a nice looling black-and-white line drawing with different kinds of line weights etc.
What I now want to produce is the final drawing based on the very lines of this dxf, something like this (see picture). I do a bit of trimming changing line weights, some extra fill etc. In this example I´ve just use part of the dxf-drawing.
However as I mentioned in my previous request, I simply cannot find a straight way to get this perfect dxf-file working within inkscape. Converting dxf2svg doesn´t help either. Since this file consists of around 1000 objects, inkscape gets very very slow or even crashes. (Windows XP, 1000 MB memory).
From SolidWorks I could also export a bitmap and then manually trace it in
inksape. But that would be a wast of time. Since I´ve got all those lines already within the dxf.
Denis, please let me know you are still intrested to pass you such a dxf-file for experimenting with it.
Lindauer DORNIER GmbH Rickenbacher Str. 119 88129 Lindau / Germany Phone: +49 8382 703-0 Fax: +49 8382 703-4 15 webmaster@...2272... http://www.lindauerdornier.com
Commercial Registry: HR Kempten Nr. B/1220
Chairman of the Supervisory Board: Prof. Dr. Dieter Feddersen, Managing Directors: Peter D. Dornier (CEO), Michael Ebeling, Dr. Andreas Rutz, Hans-Jürgen Schmidt (CFO)
Marcel.Tippmann@...2272... wrote the following on 6/8/2007 9:06 AM:
Denis Fernandes - inkscape-user-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net schrieb am 08.06.2007 11:18:26:
What exactly do you want to do with the imported CAD in Inkscape? Put it pretty for showcase printing, or something technical?
here I give you some more detailed example on how I would like to combine CAD-data with Inkscape:
In my case I draw black-and-white line illustrations for instruction manuals (weaving machines).
Since I do have together with our engeneers direct access to our 3D SolidWorks Database, I can load the 3D Model directly on my Computer. I´ll then rotate the model to a view that I need (mostly some kind of isometric view). I then export the given view as a CAD file such as dxf (see picture). I now have the accurate lines within a dxf-file. However the CAD-system is not suitable or flexible enough to produce a nice looling black-and-white line drawing with different kinds of line weights etc.
What I now want to produce is the final drawing based on the very lines of this dxf, something like this (see picture). I do a bit of trimming changing line weights, some extra fill etc. In this example I´ve just use part of the dxf-drawing.
However as I mentioned in my previous request, I simply cannot find a straight way to get this perfect dxf-file working within inkscape. Converting dxf2svg doesn´t help either. Since this file consists of around 1000 objects, inkscape gets very very slow or even crashes. (Windows XP, 1000 MB memory).
From SolidWorks I could also export a bitmap and then manually trace it in inksape. But that would be a wast of time. Since I´ve got all those lines already within the dxf.
Denis, please let me know you are still intrested to pass you such a dxf-file for experimenting with it.
Lindauer DORNIER GmbH Rickenbacher Str. 119 88129 Lindau / Germany Phone: +49 8382 703-0 Fax: +49 8382 703-4 15 webmaster@...2272... http://www.lindauerdornier.com
This is a really interesting post. I was just doing something like this two days ago.
I am in the same boat. I have Autodesk Inventor instead of SolidWorks though. I had a logo that was sent to me in dxf format. After struggling a bit with Inkscape I gave in and fired up Adobe Illustrator. I am not proficient with Illustrator but I use it on occasion because our advertising agency sends me stuff designed in it. With Illustrator I was able to just open the dxf and then save it out as svg. Inkscape opened this svg file up wonderfully. Also, Illustrator cut up the svg file into many vectors. I was able to un group everything and select the individual vector to color it. This is something that does not happen when you just trace and image in Inkscape.
So I experimented a bit with Inventor, Illustrator and Inkscape. Unfortunately, I have not figured out how to cut Illustrator completely out of the picture...so to speak. :(
heathenx
heathenex inkscape-user-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net schrieb am 08.06.2007 15:49:36:
This is a really interesting post. I was just doing something like this two days ago.
I am in the same boat. I have Autodesk Inventor instead of SolidWorks though. I had a logo that was sent to me in dxf format. After struggling a bit with Inkscape I gave in and fired up Adobe Illustrator. I am not proficient with Illustrator but I use it on occasion because our advertising agency sends me stuff designed in it. With Illustrator I was able to just open the dxf and then save it out as svg.
Inkscape opened this svg file up wonderfully. Also,
Illustrator cut up the svg file into many vectors.
Its not Illustrator cutting the file up into many objects. Its the nature of a dxf being exported from a CAD tool. Inkscape can handle those dxf2svg illustrator-files as long as the number of cut up objects within this file are small. (In your case it was just a logo. In mine its complex maschinery) Inkscape starts crashing with 1000 objects or more. This are the typ of dxf-files I´m using. While illustrator runs smoothly no matter how big those dxfs are.
This is why I´m completely stuck with illustrator in my case.
Marcel
On 6/8/07, Marcel.Tippmann@...2272... <Marcel.Tippmann@...2272...> wrote:
heathenex inkscape-user-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net schrieb am 08.06.2007 15:49:36:
This is a really interesting post. I was just doing something like this two days ago.
I am in the same boat. I have Autodesk Inventor instead of SolidWorks though. I had a logo that was sent to me in dxf format. After struggling a bit with Inkscape I gave in and fired up Adobe Illustrator. I am not proficient with Illustrator but I use it on occasion because our advertising agency sends me stuff designed in it. With Illustrator I was able to just open the dxf and then save it out as svg.
Inkscape opened this svg file up wonderfully. Also,
Illustrator cut up the svg file into many vectors.
Its not Illustrator cutting the file up into many objects. Its the nature of a dxf being exported from a CAD tool. Inkscape can handle those dxf2svg illustrator-files as long as the number of cut up objects within this file are small. (In your case it was just a logo. In mine its complex maschinery) Inkscape starts crashing with 1000 objects or more. This are the typ of dxf-files I´m using. While illustrator runs smoothly no matter how big those dxfs are.
This is why I´m completely stuck with illustrator in my case.
Marcel
Can you clarify, is it inkscape crashing or is it the dxf2svg? does it produce a valid svg but inkscape wont load it? do you get any error messages when it crashes? This is an area we look like we could use some work in.
john cliff wrote the following on 6/8/2007 10:44 AM:
On 6/8/07, Marcel.Tippmann@...2272... <Marcel.Tippmann@...2272...> wrote:
heathenex inkscape-user-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net schrieb am 08.06.2007 15:49:36:
This is a really interesting post. I was just doing something like this two days ago.
I am in the same boat. I have Autodesk Inventor instead of SolidWorks though. I had a logo that was sent to me in dxf format. After struggling a bit with Inkscape I gave in and fired up Adobe Illustrator. I am not proficient with Illustrator but I use it on occasion because our advertising agency sends me stuff designed in it. With Illustrator I was able to just open the dxf and then save it out as svg.
Inkscape opened this svg file up wonderfully. Also,
Illustrator cut up the svg file into many vectors.
Its not Illustrator cutting the file up into many objects. Its the nature of a dxf being exported from a CAD tool. Inkscape can handle those dxf2svg illustrator-files as long as the number of cut up objects within this file are small. (In your case it was just a logo. In mine its complex maschinery) Inkscape starts crashing with 1000 objects or more. This are the typ of dxf-files I´m using. While illustrator runs smoothly no matter how big those dxfs are.
This is why I´m completely stuck with illustrator in my case.
Marcel
Can you clarify, is it inkscape crashing or is it the dxf2svg? does it produce a valid svg but inkscape wont load it? do you get any error messages when it crashes? This is an area we look like we could use some work in.
fair enough. marcel, would you mind posting the dxf file somewhere so that we can play with it? i am a engineer as a profession an i have many complex 3d models and assemblies. everything that i have exported as dxf and brought into illustrator and then into inkscape has worked flawlessly so far. perhaps i am not hitting that 1000 object limit, though.
i have never tried the dxf2svg either. is this a plugin for inkscape of a separate program? i wouldn't mind trying it out.
heathenx
On 6/8/07, heathenx <heathenx@...155...> wrote:
john cliff wrote the following on 6/8/2007 10:44 AM:
On 6/8/07, Marcel.Tippmann@...2272... <Marcel.Tippmann@...2272...> wrote:
heathenex inkscape-user-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net schrieb am 08.06.2007 15:49:36:
This is a really interesting post. I was just doing something like this two days ago.
I am in the same boat. I have Autodesk Inventor instead of SolidWorks though. I had a logo that was sent to me in dxf format. After struggling a bit with Inkscape I gave in and fired up Adobe Illustrator. I am not proficient with Illustrator but I use it on occasion because our advertising agency sends me stuff designed in it. With Illustrator I was able to just open the dxf and then save it out as svg.
Inkscape opened this svg file up wonderfully. Also,
Illustrator cut up the svg file into many vectors.
Its not Illustrator cutting the file up into many objects. Its the nature of a dxf being exported from a CAD tool. Inkscape can handle those dxf2svg illustrator-files as long as the number of cut up objects within this file are small. (In your case it was just a logo. In mine its complex maschinery) Inkscape starts crashing with 1000 objects or more. This are the typ of dxf-files I´m using. While illustrator runs smoothly no matter how big those dxfs are.
This is why I´m completely stuck with illustrator in my case.
Marcel
Can you clarify, is it inkscape crashing or is it the dxf2svg? does it produce a valid svg but inkscape wont load it? do you get any error messages when it crashes? This is an area we look like we could use some work in.
fair enough. marcel, would you mind posting the dxf file somewhere so that we can play with it? i am a engineer as a profession an i have many complex 3d models and assemblies. everything that i have exported as dxf and brought into illustrator and then into inkscape has worked flawlessly so far. perhaps i am not hitting that 1000 object limit, though.
i have never tried the dxf2svg either. is this a plugin for inkscape of a separate program? i wouldn't mind trying it out.
heathenx
Its a seperate command line program that works as an extension to convert dxf to svg. It was done for the google SoC the year before last (i think) dont think the code has had much love since tho. Not part of the standard build on win32 am seeing if I can build it now, the code is in src/extensions/dxf2svg in SVN
Very well,
I've found two versions of dxf2svg: http://sourceforge.net/projects/dxf2svg and http://sourceforge.net/projects/dxf-svg-convert/
The 'non-inkscape' one produced results that... well, they could *perhaps* be usable if you are willing to spend a lot of time setting correctly the strokes and fills.
The '-inkscape' one, I had to download from the CVS and compile it. It can be installed as an Inkscape extension or used from the command line. The .DXF that Marcel sent me would give an error when I tried to import the DXF directly into Inkscape. However, if I previously invoke the dxf2svg from the commandd line:
denis@...2285...:~$ dxf2svg input.dxf > output.svg
It generates a valid SVG. Trying to load it into inkscape throws an error again, and the stderr of Inkscape reveals it is because of a dieresis (Ä) in the SVG file, which is not declared as utf-8. I removed the Ä from the file, and Inkscape was able to load the SVG flawlessly.
I fiddled with the resultant SVG (indeed, a bit short of 1000 shapes), and produced the PNG output that I am attaching. It's not *exactly* like the one Marcel sent to the list. Mainly, the screw-like lines on the leftmost gray piece weren't generated in my run of dxf2svg.
dxf2svg seems to generate every single line of the original drawing as an object. This is operative, but not much, because when I wanted to colour in grey the two pieces, I had to trace them manually with the bezier tool (not much work either).
At any rate, the program never crashed on me, or gave any errors (other than the dieresis one), although it was somewhat slow (but usable). I'm using Inkscape 45 on Debian (iBook G4, 512 MB RAM) mind you --- I wouldn't be surprised if the Windows version were less efficient and more crash-prone.
To sum up:
- dxf2svg-inkscape seems to be usable, if a bit rough. - Doesn't handle well non-ASCII characters: avoid them. - Generates many objects, hence careful if your Inkscape installation is crash-prone.
I hope that helps?
Denís.
Thank you for your help. I´ll try to get dxf2svg-inkscape running, as soon I can spare some time for it. I´m sure, for small dxf-files it will be useful for my kind of work.
Let me just recall what what made me starting this discussion about dxf: - With a 3D-Cad tool (in my case SolidWorks) I rotate the model into a wanted view. - From SolidWorks I export a black-white-line vektor drawing (dxf) - Convert it to svg - Import it into Inkscape However this approach, as Denis has confirmed, does produce quite a large number of objects. But all I want is a few vektor lines.
This is why I was trying a different approach via "Tracing a bitmap": - With a 3D-Cad tool(in my case SolidWorks)I rotate the model into a wanted view. - From SolidWorks I export a black-white-line bitmap drawing (.tiff-File, high resolution) - Import the tiff into inkscape - Auto trace the black-white-line bitmap drawing Visually I do get an identical vector drawing. However the trace has then again generated a large number of objects. This time a large number of filled surfaces, very awkward to manipulate. But all I want are a few vektor strokes.
Is Inkscapes tracing tool capable of generating just strokes?? I simply coudn´t find a way to get it done? For each black line in my bitmap, I just want generate just a single vector stroke out of a black bitmap stroke. Is there a tracing tool that can do this kind of thing?
Denis inkscape-user-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net schrieb am 09.06.2007 11:51:10:
Very well,
I've found two versions of dxf2svg: http://sourceforge.net/projects/dxf2svg and http://sourceforge.net/projects/dxf-svg-convert/
The 'non-inkscape' one produced results that... well, they could *perhaps* be usable if you are willing to spend a lot of time setting correctly the strokes and fills.
The '-inkscape' one, I had to download from the CVS and compile it. It can be installed as an Inkscape extension or used from the command line.
The .DXF that Marcel sent me would give an error when I tried to import the DXF directly into Inkscape. However, if I previously invoke the dxf2svg from the commandd line:
denis@...2285...:~$ dxf2svg input.dxf > output.svg
It generates a valid SVG. Trying to load it into inkscape throws an error again, and the stderr of Inkscape reveals it is because of a dieresis (Ä) in the SVG file, which is not declared as utf-8. I removed the Ä from the file, and Inkscape was able to load the SVG flawlessly.
I fiddled with the resultant SVG (indeed, a bit short of 1000 shapes), and produced the PNG output that I am attaching. It's not *exactly* like
the one Marcel sent to the list. Mainly, the screw-like lines on the leftmost gray piece weren't generated in my run of dxf2svg.
dxf2svg seems to generate every single line of the original drawing as an object. This is operative, but not much, because when I wanted to colour in grey the two pieces, I had to trace them manually with the bezier tool (not much work either).
At any rate, the program never crashed on me, or gave any errors (other than the dieresis one), although it was somewhat slow (but usable). I'm using Inkscape 45 on Debian (iBook G4, 512 MB RAM) mind you --- I wouldn't be surprised if the Windows version were less efficient and more crash-prone.
To sum up:
- dxf2svg-inkscape seems to be usable, if a bit rough.
- Doesn't handle well non-ASCII characters: avoid them.
- Generates many objects, hence careful if your Inkscape installation is
crash-prone.
I hope that helps?
Denís.
-- ########################### # Denís Fernández Cabrera # # denis@...2126... # # gatonegro.ceibes.org # ###########################
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Hi, We have had exactly the same problem one year ago to design an svg interface for a cnc machine we have had to use different complicated methods in order being able converting 3D CAD files to inkscape . Best Regards Steph
heathenx a écrit :
Marcel.Tippmann@...2272... wrote the following on 6/8/2007 9:06 AM:
Denis Fernandes - inkscape-user-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net schrieb am 08.06.2007 11:18:26:
What exactly do you want to do with the imported CAD in Inkscape? Put it pretty for showcase printing, or something technical?
here I give you some more detailed example on how I would like to combine CAD-data with Inkscape:
In my case I draw black-and-white line illustrations for instruction manuals (weaving machines).
Since I do have together with our engeneers direct access to our 3D SolidWorks Database, I can load the 3D Model directly on my Computer. I´ll then rotate the model to a view that I need (mostly some kind of isometric view). I then export the given view as a CAD file such as dxf (see picture). I now have the accurate lines within a dxf-file. However the CAD-system is not suitable or flexible enough to produce a nice looling black-and-white line drawing with different kinds of line weights etc.
What I now want to produce is the final drawing based on the very lines of this dxf, something like this (see picture). I do a bit of trimming changing line weights, some extra fill etc. In this example I´ve just use part of the dxf-drawing.
However as I mentioned in my previous request, I simply cannot find a straight way to get this perfect dxf-file working within inkscape. Converting dxf2svg doesn´t help either. Since this file consists of around 1000 objects, inkscape gets very very slow or even crashes. (Windows XP, 1000 MB memory).
From SolidWorks I could also export a bitmap and then manually trace it in inksape. But that would be a wast of time. Since I´ve got all those lines already within the dxf.
Denis, please let me know you are still intrested to pass you such a dxf-file for experimenting with it.
Lindauer DORNIER GmbH Rickenbacher Str. 119 88129 Lindau / Germany Phone: +49 8382 703-0 Fax: +49 8382 703-4 15 webmaster@...2272... http://www.lindauerdornier.com
This is a really interesting post. I was just doing something like this two days ago.
I am in the same boat. I have Autodesk Inventor instead of SolidWorks though. I had a logo that was sent to me in dxf format. After struggling a bit with Inkscape I gave in and fired up Adobe Illustrator. I am not proficient with Illustrator but I use it on occasion because our advertising agency sends me stuff designed in it. With Illustrator I was able to just open the dxf and then save it out as svg. Inkscape opened this svg file up wonderfully. Also, Illustrator cut up the svg file into many vectors. I was able to un group everything and select the individual vector to color it. This is something that does not happen when you just trace and image in Inkscape.
So I experimented a bit with Inventor, Illustrator and Inkscape. Unfortunately, I have not figured out how to cut Illustrator completely out of the picture...so to speak. :(
heathenx
This SF.net email is sponsored by DB2 Express Download DB2 Express C - the FREE version of DB2 express and take control of your XML. No limits. Just data. Click to get it now. http://sourceforge.net/powerbar/db2/ _______________________________________________ Inkscape-user mailing list Inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-user
I was trying to draw a house plan to scale and the biggest issue is measurements of lines - if Inkscape could tell me how long something is (even when it's at an angle) that would make a big difference.
So, I moved my project over to Qcad (Linux version too!) where things are far more awkward, but still better for the purpose of CAD than Inkscape.
Please - one of the brains out there - merge Inkscape and Qcad ! :D
/d
Dear People,
I totally agree with a better merge of Inskape and any CAD-creatures out there. As an Industrial Designer, I need to combine technical with artistic drawings/skills, for example to make a presentation drawing out of a technical drawing. Then I need the accurate shapes from a CAD-program together with the flexibiltiy from a vector program like Inkscape. (or, anyway, I have the shapes in CAD anyway and I don't want to draw it all over again in Inkscape...) I wish this integration was easier, but Inkscape is not blame: neither Illustrator nor Corel nor Flash managed to do this very well either...
Other uses of combinig CAD-programs with Inkscape (or for that matter: any vector program, but why not use the BEST?) -interior design: nicely lay-out walls with custom "wallpaper" as an inkscape-pattern... -flow charts and organigrams -3d -typography -pictogram design -instuction manuals, exploded views, etc...
Also, mind that the workflow from some CAD programs is simply different from vector-programs. SolidWorks is feature-based, something I mis in Inkscpae apart from the rectangles and polygons.
So, YES, the combination of a good vector graphics program with a CAD program can be very powerfull!
I'm quite experienced with a lot of graphic and design programs, so far, I like Inskape the best! Above Flash, Corel and Illustrator.
Okay, that's all,
CIAO
-----Original Message----- From: inkscape-user-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net [mailto:inkscape-user-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net] On Behalf Of Donn Sent: 8. juni 2007 11:25 To: inkscape-user@lists.sourceforge.net Cc: Marcel.Tippmann@...2272...; Florian.Stroessenreuther@...2272... Subject: Re: [Inkscape-user] stroke tracing CAD data (for black-and-whiteline illustration)?
I was trying to draw a house plan to scale and the biggest issue is measurements of lines - if Inkscape could tell me how long something is (even when it's at an angle) that would make a big difference.
So, I moved my project over to Qcad (Linux version too!) where things are far more awkward, but still better for the purpose of CAD than Inkscape.
Please - one of the brains out there - merge Inkscape and Qcad ! :D
/d
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participants (7)
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