Hi, Once again, a team of sudents from Ecole Centrale Lyon (France) has chosen to work on Inkscape in the scope of their studies. (The same kind of work that brought LPE envelope, group and staking two years ago with Johan as mentor and the Spray tool last year mentored by Cédric). This year I will be the mentor of the team of six students, let me introduce them: Boughida Rafik Desgrange Yoann Ngom Mor Pais Vincent Soyer Baptiste Petit François (project leader)
This year will be focused on a better image management in the software (based on this blueprint: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/inkscape/+spec/image-properties-dialog-enha...). Basically, they will do : * enhancement of the image properties window * smart relinking tool * small enhancements of images in Inkscape : more relative links, use the resolution at import, let the user choose at import if he wants to embbed ot to link.
The project will start in january and will last 6 months. They only have 4 dedicated hours per week, but I'm sure they will find time to do a serious work. We will post regular updates of the project on this list. The students may also ask for technical help or advice on irc and I know that the team will know how to welcome them well.
I think the best is to use a branch. This time we will host it on launchpad and register it.
You are very welcome for any support, help, ideas, reviews or anything.
Cheers! Steren
Hello Steren,
I asked a friend of mine about Inkscape. And he told me that he would like to have a kind of edit possibility for the images.
So if you (your students) also prepare an edit button. That would help a lot. I would spent some time to transfer the image to gimp and back. the question here also if the image should be edited as the image or as a copy.
HTH, Adib.
2009/12/1 Steren <steren.giannini@...400...>:
Hi, Once again, a team of sudents from Ecole Centrale Lyon (France) has chosen to work on Inkscape in the scope of their studies. (The same kind of work that brought LPE envelope, group and staking two years ago with Johan as mentor and the Spray tool last year mentored by Cédric). This year I will be the mentor of the team of six students, let me introduce them: Boughida Rafik Desgrange Yoann Ngom Mor Pais Vincent Soyer Baptiste Petit François (project leader)
This year will be focused on a better image management in the software (based on this blueprint: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/inkscape/+spec/image-properties-dialog-enha... ). Basically, they will do :
- enhancement of the image properties window
- smart relinking tool
- small enhancements of images in Inkscape : more relative links, use the
resolution at import, let the user choose at import if he wants to embbed ot to link.
The project will start in january and will last 6 months. They only have 4 dedicated hours per week, but I'm sure they will find time to do a serious work. We will post regular updates of the project on this list. The students may also ask for technical help or advice on irc and I know that the team will know how to welcome them well. I think the best is to use a branch. This time we will host it on launchpad and register it. You are very welcome for any support, help, ideas, reviews or anything. Cheers! Steren
Join us December 9, 2009 for the Red Hat Virtual Experience, a free event focused on virtualization and cloud computing. Attend in-depth sessions from your desk. Your couch. Anywhere. http://p.sf.net/sfu/redhat-sfdev2dev _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
One feature that would be really nice if one can "node-edit" an image, which crops it. What I mean is: select an image, switch to the node tool, then knots appear on the 4 corners of the image. When the knots are moved, a clipping mask is applied to the image and the knots (and corresponding path) belong to this clipping path.
sorry if the explanation is too brief. I think CorelDraw has this behavior which sounds very nice to me. See the "simple crop" procedure here http://www.engrave.ca/archives/1210.
I am planning on working on this feature, but if the students want to create it, I'm happy to let them ;) It'd be nice if the student's work could take this future behavior into account, by providing a "remove clipping path" button in the dialog for example.
Cheers, Johan
On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 6:04 PM, <J.B.C.Engelen@...1578...> wrote:
One feature that would be really nice if one can "node-edit" an image, which crops it. What I mean is: select an image, switch to the node tool, then knots appear on the 4 corners of the image. When the knots are moved, a clipping mask is applied to the image and the knots (and corresponding path) belong to this clipping path.
Why a rectangle and not an arbitrary shape?
I think the idea of auto-applying a clippath to an image in Node tool is good, but it must happen not on switch to the tool of course, but e.g. on doubleclicking the image in the Node tool.
-----Original Message----- From: bulia byak [mailto:buliabyak@...400...] Sent: woensdag 2 december 2009 0:09 To: Engelen, J.B.C. (Johan) Cc: steren.giannini@...400...; theadib@...1439...; inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; Francois.Petit@...2281... Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] New student project : better image management
On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 6:04 PM, <J.B.C.Engelen@...1578...> wrote:
One feature that would be really nice if one can
"node-edit" an image, which crops it. What I mean is: select an image, switch to the node tool, then knots appear on the 4 corners of the image. When the knots are moved, a clipping mask is applied to the image and the knots (and corresponding path) belong to this clipping path.
Why a rectangle and not an arbitrary shape?
I think the idea of auto-applying a clippath to an image in Node tool is good, but it must happen not on switch to the tool of course, but e.g. on doubleclicking the image in the Node tool.
Any arbitrary path. The node tool starts out with a rectangle, because in that case no clippath is applied. Clippath is applied when nodes are moved. Doubleclicking is maybe better, but perhaps a bit weird for people that automatically double click some times... ;)
Just throwing the idea out here. Haven't thought about making it Inkscape-grade user friendly :-)
On Tue, 2009-12-01 at 19:09 -0400, bulia byak wrote:
On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 6:04 PM, <J.B.C.Engelen@...1578...> wrote:
One feature that would be really nice if one can "node-edit" an image, which crops it. What I mean is: select an image, switch to the node tool, then knots appear on the 4 corners of the image. When the knots are moved, a clipping mask is applied to the image and the knots (and corresponding path) belong to this clipping path.
Why a rectangle and not an arbitrary shape?
You mean if there is a transparent border? (so it fits the shape of what's visible?)
I think the idea of auto-applying a clippath to an image in Node tool is good, but it must happen not on switch to the tool of course, but e.g. on doubleclicking the image in the Node tool.
I completely agree and double-clicking sounds like a great solution!
Cheers, Josh
2009/12/2 Joshua A. Andler <scislac@...400...>:
I think the idea of auto-applying a clippath to an image in Node tool is good, but it must happen not on switch to the tool of course, but e.g. on doubleclicking the image in the Node tool.
I completely agree and double-clicking sounds like a great solution!
Cheers, Josh
I think it should be under right click. I would expect double clicking an image to bring up an external editor or a trace dialog but never a clipping path. If I were to search for something like this I would first look in right click menu for an option named "crop image." This would just add a clipping rectangle and select it for editing.
The right click menus need a serious overhaul, because they are now rather useless in most cases and they could be immensely helpful in minimizing the distance the user's mouse pointer must travel to do meaningful things :)
Regards, Krzysztof
On Wed, 2009-12-02 at 00:24 +0100, Krzysztof Kosiński wrote:
2009/12/2 Joshua A. Andler <scislac@...400...>:
I think the idea of auto-applying a clippath to an image in Node tool is good, but it must happen not on switch to the tool of course, but e.g. on doubleclicking the image in the Node tool.
I completely agree and double-clicking sounds like a great solution!
Cheers, Josh
I think it should be under right click. I would expect double clicking an image to bring up an external editor or a trace dialog but never a clipping path. If I were to search for something like this I would first look in right click menu for an option named "crop image." This would just add a clipping rectangle and select it for editing.
I really think the double-clicking in the Node Tool has merit... it then makes it "editable" with that tool. I think that double-clicking with the Selector Tool would perhaps do something like you described above.
The right click menus need a serious overhaul, because they are now rather useless in most cases and they could be immensely helpful in minimizing the distance the user's mouse pointer must travel to do meaningful things :)
Agreed. Ring menus!!! (just a thought)
Cheers, Josh
On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 12:09 AM, bulia byak <buliabyak@...400...> wrote:
I think the idea of auto-applying a clippath to an image in Node tool is good, but it must happen not on switch to the tool of course, but e.g. on doubleclicking the image in the Node tool.
Why couldn't it be when switching to node tool ? For me, switching to node tool has a meaning of editing the shape, I would find normal to be able to edit my image border when I click on the node tool.
I see it like this : every rectangular image is an image with a mask. When we switch to the node tool, we directly edit this mask.
Steren
On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 7:39 PM, Steren <steren.giannini@...400...> wrote:
Why couldn't it be when switching to node tool ?
Because switching tools should never change the document.
2009/12/2 Steren <steren.giannini@...400...>:
Why couldn't it be when switching to node tool ? For me, switching to node tool has a meaning of editing the shape, I would find normal to be able to edit my image border when I click on the node tool.
I see it like this : every rectangular image is an image with a mask. When we switch to the node tool, we directly edit this mask.
This looks like a good idea on the face of it but it introduces a new concept - an "intrinsic image mask". Why only images have such mask by default? Before long you will have users asking why it doesn't work on groups as well as images. Users should learn what is a clipping path instead, because this concept is sufficient. This could be done by improving the visibility of clipping-related options, and enhancing the clipping workflow in general.
The more concepts we introduce, the more confusion will result.
Using the right-click menu doesn't suffer from this, because it doesn't introduce any new concepts - it is just a shortcut that combines creating a rectangle of the same size as the image and applying it as a clipping path. It would behave in every respect like a normal clipping path after that.
Regards, Krzysztof
On 12/01/2009 06:24 PM, Krzysztof Kosiński wrote:
2009/12/2 Steren<steren.giannini@...400...>:
Why couldn't it be when switching to node tool ? For me, switching to node tool has a meaning of editing the shape, I would find normal to be able to edit my image border when I click on the node tool.
I see it like this : every rectangular image is an image with a mask. When we switch to the node tool, we directly edit this mask.
This looks like a good idea on the face of it but it introduces a new concept - an "intrinsic image mask". Why only images have such mask by default? Before long you will have users asking why it doesn't work on groups as well as images. Users should learn what is a clipping path instead, because this concept is sufficient. This could be done by improving the visibility of clipping-related options, and enhancing the clipping workflow in general.
The more concepts we introduce, the more confusion will result.
Using the right-click menu doesn't suffer from this, because it doesn't introduce any new concepts - it is just a shortcut that combines creating a rectangle of the same size as the image and applying it as a clipping path. It would behave in every respect like a normal clipping path after that.
Right click menus don't work that well on a touchpad - yeah I know there are ways around it, but the more "special" taps there are, the more things happen when you don't want them to. Not sure how the new yet to appear tablets will preform but my guess is they aren't really designed for right clicks and Inkscape will definitely want to play well on the tablets.
Regards, Krzysztof
Join us December 9, 2009 for the Red Hat Virtual Experience, a free event focused on virtualization and cloud computing. Attend in-depth sessions from your desk. Your couch. Anywhere. http://p.sf.net/sfu/redhat-sfdev2dev _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
2009/12/1 MilesTogoe <miles.togoe@...400...>:
Right click menus don't work that well on a touchpad
That depends on the touchpad. Good touchpads (I'm not speaking of Apple) have two buttons next to the pad.
On Dec 1, 2009, at 7:11 PM, bulia byak wrote:
2009/12/1 MilesTogoe <miles.togoe@...400...>:
Right click menus don't work that well on a touchpad
That depends on the touchpad. Good touchpads (I'm not speaking of Apple) have two buttons next to the pad.
FYI the convention on single-button touchpads, for OSX and for Linux at least, is to touch two fingers to the pad and then click the button.
For scrolling, either a two-finger drag or a drag along the edge are common.
On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 1:30 AM, Jon Cruz <jon@...18...> wrote:
2009/12/1 MilesTogoe <miles.togoe@...400...>:
Right click menus don't work that well on a touchpad
That depends on the touchpad. Good touchpads (I'm not speaking of Apple) have two buttons next to the pad.
FYI the convention on single-button touchpads, for OSX and for Linux at least, is to touch two fingers to the pad and then click the button.
Yes, and that is what I think is correctly described by the original poster as "not working well". Possible but painful.
On Dec 1, 2009, at 9:44 PM, bulia byak wrote:
On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 1:30 AM, Jon Cruz <jon@...18...> wrote:
2009/12/1 MilesTogoe <miles.togoe@...400...>:
Right click menus don't work that well on a touchpad
That depends on the touchpad. Good touchpads (I'm not speaking of Apple) have two buttons next to the pad.
FYI the convention on single-button touchpads, for OSX and for Linux at least, is to touch two fingers to the pad and then click the button.
Yes, and that is what I think is correctly described by the original poster as "not working well". Possible but painful.
Well, for me I find it actually quite simple and handy. Getting used to two-finger scroll probably helps a bit. In general I use the same movement as on an actual mouse: pointer finger for the left click and just add the middle finger for a right click.
On Dec 1, 2009, at 6:24 PM, MilesTogoe wrote:
Using the right-click menu doesn't suffer from this, because it doesn't introduce any new concepts - it is just a shortcut that combines creating a rectangle of the same size as the image and applying it as a clipping path. It would behave in every respect like a normal clipping path after that.
Right click menus don't work that well on a touchpad - yeah I know there are ways around it, but the more "special" taps there are, the more things happen when you don't want them to. Not sure how the new yet to appear tablets will preform but my guess is they aren't really designed for right clicks and Inkscape will definitely want to play well on the tablets.
Well, I think one main issue here is that nothing should be solely in the context menu. Things *can* be there, but for many people that is not the way they will want to work.
A lot of the behind-the-scenes work I've been doing will make the context menus much more useful... but at the same time those actions will also need to live multiple places in the UI. Proper encapsulation and modularity will make that all easy.
2009/12/2 Krzysztof Kosiński <tweenk.pl@...400...>
Editing clipping paths is now a toggle. If you enable it, editing
controls will be displayed for clipping paths, in addition to normal
editing controls.
I did not test the branch, but I just wanted to point out that there already is a toggle in the node tool toolbar that displays the mask nodes (available in 0.47). But maybe I didn't understand what your code is doing.
Using the right-click menu doesn't suffer from this, because it doesn't introduce any new concepts - it is just a shortcut that combines creating a rectangle of the same size as the image and applying it as a clipping path. It would behave in every respect like a normal clipping path after that.
Then we could extend this functionnality to any object. It could be placed in the Object>Mask menu and in the right click menu. It could be called "Create Mask from Bounding box"
What do you think ?
W dniu 2 grudnia 2009 09:30 użytkownik Steren <steren.giannini@...400...> napisał:
I did not test the branch, but I just wanted to point out that there already is a toggle in the node tool toolbar that displays the mask nodes (available in 0.47). But maybe I didn't understand what your code is doing.
In my branch it is possible to edit the original shape and the clipping shape at the same time - the controls are displayed simultaneously.
Then we could extend this functionnality to any object. It could be placed in the Object>Mask menu and in the right click menu. It could be called "Create Mask from Bounding box" What do you think?
Yes, it might be useful. It should automatically switch to the node tool and turn on clipping path display, otherwise it might not be apparent what this does.
Regards, Krzysztof
I agree that switching to a tool should not change the structure of the doc. May be what we need is a better way to apply masks or clippath.
IMO having a new option bar for Selector tool should be cool. The option bar should give different options if one object is select or if several are. In the last case, we could have button to add clip or mask, but align options
In the first case, we could also add automagically selection presets that could act as some kind of shortcuts to the find dialog : i.e. select all objects by a fill or stroke color same as selected object, ect
pygmee
This looks like a good idea on the face of it but it introduces a new concept - an "intrinsic image mask". Why only images have such mask by default? Before long you will have users asking why it doesn't work on groups as well as images. Users should learn what is a clipping path instead, because this concept is sufficient. This could be done by improving the visibility of clipping-related options, and enhancing the clipping workflow in general.
Hi Johan, I see what you mean, I also thought about this in the past. Indeed, it would be nice for fast image cropping. Well, it's something to consider. But I wouldn't overload too much the project. We will see how it goes, and this may be part of the "bonus targets" :).
Thanks for the idea, we will keep it at hand. Steren
2009/12/1 J.B.C.Engelen <J.B.C.Engelen@...1578...>
One feature that would be really nice if one can "node-edit" an image, which crops it. What I mean is: select an image, switch to the node tool, then knots appear on the 4 corners of the image. When the knots are moved, a clipping mask is applied to the image and the knots (and corresponding path) belong to this clipping path.
sorry if the explanation is too brief. I think CorelDraw has this behavior which sounds very nice to me. See the "simple crop" procedure here http://www.engrave.ca/archives/1210.
I am planning on working on this feature, but if the students want to create it, I'm happy to let them ;) It'd be nice if the student's work could take this future behavior into account, by providing a "remove clipping path" button in the dialog for example.
Cheers, Johan
Hello,
One feature that would be really nice if one can "node-edit" an image, which crops it. What I mean is: select an image, switch to the node tool, then knots appear on the 4 corners of the image. When the knots are moved, a clipping mask is applied to the image and the knots (and corresponding path) belong to this clipping path.
Instead of an "image-cropping-tool" wouldn't it be better to give users an easier way to edit already-applied clip paths?
It seems the only way to do this currently, is un-applying the clip path, editing it and re-applying it, which is too complicated. There should be an option, to show the clip paths (on double click) of clipped objects, and able to edit it, while the object is still clipped. (Or better yet: ability to adjust the transparency of out-of-clip regions)
So, users will be able to, for example, combine a pixel image with vector graphics, group them, apply a clip path to the compound object, and clip the whole thing. It would be too complicated, if compound objects would have to be "baked" first, to get the nice clipping experience
On Wed, 2009-12-02 at 00:32 +0100, Pascal Germroth wrote:
Hello,
One feature that would be really nice if one can "node-edit" an image, which crops it. What I mean is: select an image, switch to the node tool, then knots appear on the 4 corners of the image. When the knots are moved, a clipping mask is applied to the image and the knots (and corresponding path) belong to this clipping path.
Instead of an "image-cropping-tool" wouldn't it be better to give users an easier way to edit already-applied clip paths?
Have you tried current trunk or 0.47?
It seems the only way to do this currently, is un-applying the clip path, editing it and re-applying it, which is too complicated. There should be an option, to show the clip paths (on double click) of clipped objects, and able to edit it, while the object is still clipped. (Or better yet: ability to adjust the transparency of out-of-clip regions)
The Node Tool Controls Bar has buttons now to edit applied clippaths/masks so they can easily be edited. Works here...
Cheers, Josh
2009/12/2 Pascal Germroth <funkycoder@...400...>:
Instead of an "image-cropping-tool" wouldn't it be better to give users an easier way to edit already-applied clip paths?
Check out my node tool branch, you will like it. (bzr checkout lp:~tweenk/inkscape/gsoc-node-tool)
Editing clipping paths is now a toggle. If you enable it, editing controls will be displayed for clipping paths, in addition to normal editing controls. The attached screenshot shows this. Normally the clipping path would be visualized by a colored outline, I don't know why it stopped working at the moment, but of course it will be fixed before trunk merge.
Regards, Krzysztof
In Xara Xtreme for windows (4.0 and above) that's much simpler : every time you import an image it's automatically treated as a quadrangle with a bitmap fill (not as a clipped image).
________________________________ De : "J.B.C.Engelen@...1578..." <J.B.C.Engelen@...1578...> À : steren.giannini@...400...; theadib@...1439... Cc : inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; Francois.Petit@...2281... Envoyé le : Mar 1 Décembre 2009, 23 h 04 min 58 s Objet : Re: [Inkscape-devel] New student project : better image management
One feature that would be really nice if one can "node-edit" an image, which crops it. What I mean is: select an image, switch to the node tool, then knots appear on the 4 corners of the image. When the knots are moved, a clipping mask is applied to the image and the knots (and corresponding path) belong to this clipping path.
sorry if the explanation is too brief. I think CorelDraw has this behavior which sounds very nice to me. See the "simple crop" procedure here http://www.engrave.ca/archives/1210.
I am planning on working on this feature, but if the students want to create it, I'm happy to let them ;) It'd be nice if the student's work could take this future behavior into account, by providing a "remove clipping path" button in the dialog for example.
Cheers, Johan
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Join us December 9, 2009 for the Red Hat Virtual Experience, a free event focused on virtualization and cloud computing. Attend in-depth sessions from your desk. Your couch. Anywhere. http://p.sf.net/sfu/redhat-sfdev2dev _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 6:55 AM, Ivan Louette <ivan_louette@...48...> wrote:
In Xara Xtreme for windows (4.0 and above) that's much simpler : every time you import an image it's automatically treated as a quadrangle with a bitmap fill (not as a clipped image).
Curiously, we had the exact same option: import images as fills. That was before we even supported clipping. When clipping was made usable, that option was removed for the sake of SVG purity: an image must be an image. Still, turning it into a fill is as easy as pressing Alt+I.
Yes Alt+I works well and about the shape management it's better than Xara which only creates a quadrangular shape not editable as the rectangle and quadrangle tool.
However tiling mode has two more features in Xara : Repeat inverted and Single tile - But I don't know if SVG allows this kind of pattern tiling ?
________________________________ De : bulia byak <buliabyak@...400...> À : Ivan Louette <ivan_louette@...48...> Cc : J.B.C.Engelen@...1578...; steren.giannini@...400...; theadib@...2187....; inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; Francois.Petit@...2281... Envoyé le : Mer 2 Décembre 2009, 16 h 05 min 49 s Objet : Re: [Inkscape-devel] Re : New student project : better image management
On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 6:55 AM, Ivan Louette <ivan_louette@...48...> wrote:
In Xara Xtreme for windows (4.0 and above) that's much simpler : every time you import an image it's automatically treated as a quadrangle with a bitmap fill (not as a clipped image).
Curiously, we had the exact same option: import images as fills. That was before we even supported clipping. When clipping was made usable, that option was removed for the sake of SVG purity: an image must be an image. Still, turning it into a fill is as easy as pressing Alt+I.
thiis not what i would recommand as a good SVG practice anyway.
On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 6:55 AM, Ivan Louette <ivan_louette@...48...> wrote:
In Xara Xtreme for windows (4.0 and above) that's much simpler :
every time
you import an image it's automatically treated as a quadrangle with
a bitmap
fill (not as a clipped image).
Curiously, we had the exact same option: import images as fills. That was before we even supported clipping. When clipping was made usable, that option was removed for the sake of SVG purity: an image must be an image. Still, turning it into a fill is as easy as pressing Alt+I.
-- bulia byak Inkscape. Draw Freely. http://www.inkscape.org
Join us December 9, 2009 for the Red Hat Virtual Experience, a free event focused on virtualization and cloud computing. Attend in-depth sessions from your desk. Your couch. Anywhere. http://p.sf.net/sfu/redhat-sfdev2dev _______________________________________________ Inkscape-devel mailing list Inkscape-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
participants (11)
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unknown＠example.com -
bulia byak -
Cédric Gémy -
Ivan Louette -
Jon Cruz -
Joshua A. Andler -
Krzysztof Kosiński -
MilesTogoe -
Pascal Germroth -
Steren -
the Adib