- Inkscape Devel - Inkscape Mailman

Re: [Inkscape-devel] do we need meters?
by bulia byak 25 Jan '04

25 Jan '04

>>lists only cm, mm, in, pt, pc. So the question is: why do we have meters >>in the units drop-down lists at all? Isn't it safer to remove them? >> >>Any insights? > >I've used inkscape for doing house plans. Having meters was quite useful >for that. We may end up having a global scale factor for doing map work >(which is something that bryce was interested in). Of course it's useful, but what about SVG conformance? Even if we convert meters to e.g. inches on save, how will Inkscape know that they should be translated back to meters when loaded? Looks like we need inkscape: attributes in <svg> for scale factor and preferred length units. That will require changes in a lot of places I think. _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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undo crash
by bulia byak 25 Jan '04

25 Jan '04

Mental, could you please review my change to xml/repr-action.cpp in line 230, instead of if (strcmp(action->act.chgattr.oldval, iter->act.chgattr.newval)) break; I added extra checks if (action->act.chgattr.oldval && iter->act.chgattr.newval && strcmp(action->act.chgattr.oldval, iter->act.chgattr.newval)) break; Without this, it was crashing when you draw a rect and press and hold [ to rotate it, after several rotations. This crash appeared after I changed document_undo to maybe_undo with a key, so there's probably some deeper problem with your coalescing code that was not caught until now (because almost nobody used maybe_undo until now). So if you can discover what's really going wrong and fix it instead that would be great. By the way I fixed the nasty "fly away" bug on rotation reported by Robert Crosbie and myself. Although I don't quite understand how that fix works :) See changelog. _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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do we need meters?
by bulia byak 25 Jan '04

25 Jan '04

With this kind of silence in this list, I wonder if we really need a separate users list... Anyway, when researching https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=851007&group_id=9… I found that the SVG units reader simply does not understand meters as a unit. And this seems to be correct according to the spec. Here: http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG11/coords.html#Units it says that SVG uses "absolute unit identifiers from CSS", and CSS grammar: http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-CSS2/grammar.html#q1 lists only cm, mm, in, pt, pc. So the question is: why do we have meters in the units drop-down lists at all? Isn't it safer to remove them? Any insights? _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] Proposal: "inkscape-user@" mailing list
by bulia byak 24 Jan '04

24 Jan '04

>If this sounds good, I'll set it up, and we can push membership in it >as part of the 0.37 announce. Good idea I think. Please don't forget to mention it in the release notes. _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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HELP SYSTEM: scrollkeeper + yelp
by Jonathan Phillips 22 Jan '04

22 Jan '04

In regards to implementing a cross-platform help system, we can use docbook in conjunction with scrollkeeper/yelp on Linux and OS X, and then convert to Microsoft HTML Help from docbook for win32 based systems. Check out the docbook formats: http://docbook.org/wiki/moin.cgi/formats More about docbook: http://docbook.sourceforge.net/ Any other findings? Jon -- Jonathan Phillips <jon@...15...>

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] RE: keyboard shortcuts + man page
by bulia byak 22 Jan '04

22 Jan '04

>For Windows, you need to consider converting the files >to Windows help files. That is all, as the OS has its >own viewer. Which is why I wonder if we'd be better off with HTML files. There's a browser on any system, and no conversions are necessary. Actually some Windows programs use HTML too, instead of Windows help. The only issue is determining the default browser. _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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RE: keyboard shortcuts + man page
by bulia byak 21 Jan '04

21 Jan '04

>From: Jonathan Phillips <jon@...15...> >I have not done much looking into adding the keyboard shortcuts and man >page to the help menu for the next release. I really want to do this >task, but could you use any help pointing me how to do this. > >I wonder what the best way to accomplish this task would be? I guess we >could add a link to the keyboard shortcuts page to the webpage where the >shortcut keys are located, or we could set up a file where the keyboard >keys are located in the source and you could edit that file so that on >CVS build, all keys are updated accordingly. I think Inkscape should ship with its own copy of help files in HTML, corresponding to the release. I think I will move the shortcuts from Wiki to XML and set up generating HTML in makefile. So, you can assume that the distribution includes an HTML file; your task is to run browser on it. As to the best way to run browser, I'm not sure. I doubt there is a cross-platform reliable way to detect the default browser and run it, but I may be wrong - anyone? If we cannot access default browser, perhaps we should store a browser executable path in preferences. But that's ugly. >Another idea is to start to use YELP from GNOME world. Never seen it. Anyone has an opinion on Yelp? >Another thing, did you realize that Inkscape can open files from URLs. I >opened a few svg examples from croczilla.com/svg/ from the commandline. Sounds like this could be added to Tips-and-tricks page. >I think we should add an open file from url menu item. Why not, try to do it - it should not be difficult. _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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NR::Point data
by MenTaLguY 21 Jan '04

21 Jan '04

Just a quick note that NR::Point's 'pt' data member is now private; use its operator[]() instead. (since NR::Point::operator[] returns a reference, it can be used as an lvalue, thusly: somepoint[NR::X] = somevalue; ) -mental

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] more [] <> fun
by bulia byak 21 Jan '04

21 Jan '04

>Hold down on one of the rotate keys with the XML editor open (watching the >object coordinates) and the object will quickly fly off the screen with >large compounded errors in the cordinates. Indeed. This may be related to https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=879249&group_id=9… It may be that XML editor slows dows something enough for this effect to become worse, but it looks like the same problem can be observed without the XML editor open. I'm almost sure that my code is not the culprit; probably it just makes some deeper problem more obvious. With mouse, nobody could make so many transformations so quickly, and so this problem remained unnoticed. _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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news: page options, dialogs
by bulia byak 21 Jan '04

21 Jan '04

I ported the support for page background color and border color from sodipodi. It uses sodipodi:namedview for storing them, so I also moved the recently added page shadow option from preferences to namedview for consistency. This means it may be different in different documents and is saved with the document, as is the page size, background color, etc. To set all these options for newly created documents, edit the sodipodi:namedview template in your ~/.inkscape/preferences.xml. I also ported the color selectors for the page and border colors; they are now on the Page tab of the Document Options dialog. And while at it, I finally moved the former "document settings" dialog stuff here and removed that dialog. No more confusion: now we have one Document Options dialog (Ctrl+Shift+D) which sets everything that will be saved with the document (as opposed to Inkscape Options which is supposed to set options independent of documents). Now the Dialogs menu contains just two "stray" dialogs that are planned for elimination, and is generally much less confusing than before. Of course the dialogs need a lot of work still, but that could wait until Gtkmm. _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] zooming by wheel
by bulia byak 20 Jan '04

20 Jan '04

>Please use keybindings consistantly. Please use Ctrl+Wheel for Zooming >instead of Shift+Wheel. I was not proposing shift-wheel to zoom; it was coded already, I just changed the centering behavior. We have this item in the roadmap: * Decide on mouse scrollwheel modifiers [everyone, see mailing list archives] So, once you raised the issue, could you please review the current wheel behaviors: # Mouse wheel scroll canvas vertically # Ctrl + Mouse wheel scroll canvas horizontally # Shift + Mouse wheel zoom in or out and propose a change to conform to HIG, but without losing any of the three functions. After you publish your proposal here, if no one objects, I will code it. _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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zooming by wheel
by bulia byak 20 Jan '04

20 Jan '04

I used cursor coordinates (instead of window center) when zooming in/out by scrollwheel with Shift. So you can position mouse over any object and zoom into it without moving mouse. But I can't test it as I don't have a wheel mouse. Could anyone with a wheel mouse please test it? _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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more [] <> fun
by bulia byak 20 Jan '04

20 Jan '04

Today my daughter enjoyed Inkscape thus: draw a freehand line, click the node tool, select all nodes, and press-and-hold <, >, [, ] randomly. Lots of fun from the "dancing zuka." ("Zuka" means approximately "an unidentifiable funny shape".) The new shortcuts listed below more or less close my list of planned new features for the release. From now on I'm focusing on bugs and urge everyone to do the same. There's one problem I discovered in X keyboard handling: pressing both Alts with some other keys results in Alt being stuck, and you'll have to press single Alt plus something to unstick it. I don't know if this is a bug in X (it works this way everywhere, so it's certainly not an Inkscape problem) or some sort of feature that I don't know how to turn off. Any ideas? Node tool shortcuts (F2, n) * [, ] rotate both control handles around the node by the global rotate step (default 15 degrees) * Left Ctrl+[, Left Ctrl+], Right Ctrl+[, Right Ctrl+] rotate one of the controls by the global rotate step * Left Alt+[, Left Alt+], Right Alt+[, Right Alt+] rotate one of the handles by the angle corresponding to 1 pixel (actual angle depends on zoom) * Left Alt+Right Alt+[, Left Alt+Right Alt+] rotate both controls by the angle corresponding to 1 pixel * <, > make both control handles shorter or longer by the scale step (default 2 pt) * Left Ctrl+<, Left Ctrl+>, Right Ctrl+<, Right Ctrl+> make one of the control handles shorter or longer by the scale step (default 2 pt) * Left Alt+<, Left Alt+>, Right Alt+<, Right Alt+> make one of the control handles shorter or longer by 1 pixel (actual distance depends on zoom) * Left Alt+Right Alt+<, Left Alt+Right Alt+> make both control handles shorter or longer by 1 pixel Note: Instead of the < and > keys, you can use the , (comma) and . (period) keys respectively _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] website broken - what's going on?
by bulia byak 20 Jan '04

20 Jan '04

Hmm, now it works again. >From: "bulia byak" <archiver_1@...19...> >To: inkscape-devel(a)lists.sourceforge.net >Subject: [Inkscape-devel] website broken - what's going on? >Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 17:55:50 +0000 > >You have probably reached this page in error. > >If you were attempting to reach a site that's domain ends in >.sourceforge.net, it is likely that your browser is not HTTP/1.1 compliant. >This may be because you're running a very old version of MSIE or Netscape. > >Please upgrade your browser and try again. > >_________________________________________________________________ >STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* >http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms… > > > >------------------------------------------------------- >The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 >Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration >See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. >http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn >_______________________________________________ >Inkscape-devel mailing list >Inkscape-devel(a)lists.sourceforge.net >https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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website broken - what's going on?
by bulia byak 20 Jan '04

20 Jan '04

You have probably reached this page in error. If you were attempting to reach a site that's domain ends in .sourceforge.net, it is likely that your browser is not HTTP/1.1 compliant. This may be because you're running a very old version of MSIE or Netscape. Please upgrade your browser and try again. _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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[ 880559 ] Loading place text in wrong place
by bulia byak 20 Jan '04

20 Jan '04

The bug is not in wrong display; actually Inkscape displays your file correctly and Sodipodi does not. The bug was in adding extra newlines when the file was saved. This bug is fixed in CVS. However, to fix your existing file, you'll have to manually remove any wrong whitespace between <tspan> elements within <text> elements. E.g. instead of <text> <tspan>English</tspan> </text> you should have <text><tspan>English</tspan></text> Or, you can load your file into Inkscape CVS, manually remove the extra newlines and save the file. _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/photos&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjo…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] new rotate/scale shortcuts
by bulia byak 20 Jan '04

20 Jan '04

>I get a crash if you scale a shape too big with the modifier keys. > >[kidproto@...174... .inkscape]$ inkscape >inkscape: nr-svp-uncross.cpp:747: NRSVLSlice* >nr_svl_slice_stretch_list(NRSVLSlice*, double): Assertion `v->next' >failed. >,Aborted I think you'd get it regardless of the method of scaling. Actually that's a general problem - I remember seeing the same error several times, which indicates that NR simply does not guard against too big values. Please file a bug, and hopefully our numeric experts will have a look at it one day... _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] page shadow
by bulia byak 20 Jan '04

20 Jan '04

>>Personally I find 1 or 2 annoyingly small. To me, it's either 0 or 5. > >What about percentage of the full screen? Don't think it's a good idea. The shadow must be easily recognizable so as to easily differentiate it from objects. A physically constant size is important for that recognizability. _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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new rotate/scale shortcuts
by bulia byak 20 Jan '04

20 Jan '04

* [, ] rotate selected object(s) by the angle step (default 15 degrees) * Ctrl+[, Ctrl+] rotate selected object(s) by 90 degrees * Alt+[, Alt+] rotate selected object(s) by the angle corresponding to 1 pixel (actual angle depends on zoom) * <, > scale selected object(s) around center by the scale step (default 2 pt) * Ctrl+<, Ctrl+> scale selected object(s) to 50% or 200% respectively * Alt+[, Alt+] scale selected object(s) by 1 pixel (actual size increment depends on zoom) Note: Instead of the < and > keys, you can use the , (comma) and . (period) keys respectively _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/features&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] zooming by wheel
by bulia byak 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

>The usability of this would be to be drawing a complex shape and while >drawing with the line/freehand tool, one could hit shift and use the >scrollwheel and be able to zoom closer into where your mouse pointer is >at on screen. Try just that and it won't work. What exactly does it do instead? Centers the zoomed point after zoom? Or does not zoom at all? >Oh BTW, this functionality I just described works great on a >scrollwheel, 3-button mouse by clicking (not scrolling-wheel) the middle >button and being able to zoom closer/further from what is being drawing. Yes, this is what I implemented first, and then just copied that code into wheel-zoom. It should work. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] Add/Subtract Nodes + scissor tool + razor tool
by bulia byak 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

>where one could hold a modifier key BEFORE clicking on a >node, where the mouse pointer adds a little modifier icon to the node >edit tool, That is, to the mouse pointer. Yes, ideally any meaningful modifier keypress or mouse action should change mouse cursor and provide a useful statusbar hint. It's in my plans, although currently we still have more urgent usability problems... _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] Add/Subtract Nodes + scissor tool + razor tool
by bulia byak 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

>Add/subtract Nodes + scissor tool >http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=880110&group_id=93… Add nodes by clicking anywhere on path: Yes, would be nice. Also editing a bezier curve by dragging it (as opposed to dragging handles). This however involves some nontrivial math so I'm not sure who and when can do it. (Although Gimp does bezier dragging, so we could steal the algorithm there.) Delete nodes by mouse: try ctrl-alt-click Break path at a node: propose a click modifier, it's easy to add >Razor Tool >http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=880099&group_id=93… I'm against "razor" as a separate tool, it would mean a lot of duplication of code from freehand tool, and is a toy anyway. What we need instead is one more boolean op: Divide, where the bottom object is cut into pieces along the path of the top one. This way you can precisely draw and adjust your cut path using regular tools, reuse it if necessary, etc. It's a more generic solution. And it's easy to implement now, by combining Intersect and Subtract. So you can add it to the RFE list and probably to the roadmap. _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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Add/Subtract Nodes + scissor tool + razor tool
by Jonathan Phillips 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

Hello All, After using Inkscape exclusively to design with and comparing it with ADOBE Illustrator and Freehand and having my design buddies use the app, there are a few features I think would be very beneficial to discuss and hopefully implement in the near future. Add/subtract Nodes + scissor tool http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=880110&group_id=93… Razor Tool http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=880099&group_id=93… I know that we are coming up on a release and feature freeze this week, but hopefully we could look at adding these to the next release/roadmap and discuss them. Jon -- Jonathan Phillips <jon@...15...>

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SF cvs downtime
by Bob Jamison 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

For those who didn't know it, SF's cvs is having a scheduled maintenance downtime, which has been extended: http://sourceforge.net/docman/display_doc.php?docid=2352&group_id=1#top So,, we're still waiting... ;-) Bob

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] coding standards
by bulia byak 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

>On Sun, Jan 18, 2004 at 11:12:47PM +0000, bulia byak wrote: > > >>http://paul.oniony.com/sections/information/tabsversusspaces.html > > > > > >I'm arguing for what he calls "Hybrid Indentation". > > > > I'd prefer it too. My XEmacs inserts tabs for me, and I don't really >want > > to learn reconfiguring it. There are more interesting problems :) > >Most ppl seem to think hybrid indentation is good, but I haven't yet >seen anyone give emacs/vim/indent/astyle settings to do this >automatically. As I understand it, in hybrid indentation the spaces are needed only for wrapped lines; normal lines only use tabs. Which is why I like it: normally the editor inserts tabs for me, and in the rare cases when I do need to wrap lines (which I usually avoid) I don't mind hitting space a few times so it looks decent. _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/photos&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjo…

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coding standards
by Jonathan Phillips 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

I say we lock-in our coding style standards over the next day or so. We have much to clean-up b4 a release date and some tasks are waiting for admin. decisions. TABS I say we lock-in at 4 spaces is a tab, and correct that in the files. GOOD? Please take some time to look at that coding standards document and help clean it up. If we lock-in our standards for the project now, then lotsa ppl can help clean-up the code, help document it, and then we can move forward with C++'ification even more. Jon -- Jonathan Phillips <jon@...15...>

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Call for Screenshots on Different Platforms (WIN32 + OS X)
by Jonathan Phillips 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

Hello all, I've added a section on the wiki about editing/changing the website at http://inkscape.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?WebsiteEditing Could some of you with an OS X version and WIN32 version of Inkscape make some screenshots and put them up on the website. If it is too much of a hassle to deal with, then email me a link to your screenshot, but in the most GNU of ways, this is DIY. You can see the ones I've added already. Thanks, Jon -- Jonathan Phillips <jon@...15...>

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a stealth delete again :(
by bulia byak 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

The GTK color selector is gone :((( /* REJON: I'm commenting this fucker out because its too big on the screen when editing. It is especially bad on screens <= to 1024by768 */ As I wrote, the color wheel is way more usable than sliders for everyday work, and this selector should actually be made the default. If you think it's too big, let's discuss possible ways to improve that, instead of "treating headache with a guilliotine"! BTW, the HSV wheel selector is in the release notes already. If I didn't notice that removal, we could have a false statement in the release notes. So, Jon, I urge you to please restore this feature (unless you have more arguments against it, in which case please share them here). And ance again, a reminder for everyone: in addition to any possible discussions on jabber, PLEASE also post to the list before deleting any features. It's really annoying to discover such things by chance. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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time to focus on bugs
by bulia byak 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

I think it's high time to start the pre-release bug hunt. The number of open bugs is huge, and some of them are pretty nasty. Please everyone take time to review the list and fix/close whatever possible. Mental, I would be really grateful for your help with XML editor bugs (850971, 852619, 864791, 869683, 872277) and undo bugs (877238, 861462), plus the ruler bugs and action-per-view bugs assigned to you. Whenever you have time. (How was your job interview?) Also Mental, would you care to add a brief description on your recent URI changes to the release notes? There are also a few weird bugs that seem to display some deep problems with NR subsystem or some other geometry code: 879249 (really annoying, probably many other problems are caused by this), 871342, 871508, 859579. If someone with a better knowledge of NR could have a look that would be great. Jon, any progress with the non-ascii filenames? _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] page shadow
by bulia byak 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

>I'd really prefer we settled on a shadow size that more or less worked >for everyone (1 or 2 pixels, I suspect) and stuck with that. Personally I find 1 or 2 annoyingly small. To me, it's either 0 or 5. >We have to pick and choose what we make a preference, otherwise we >render the preferences dialog (once we have one) unnavigable from sheer >volume of preferences. Not all preferences need to be in the dialog. Some may be only editable in the pref file. Or we can add an "advanced" tab later. >Besides being able to turn off the page outline (which I believe is >already a preference, No such preference AFAIK. Which is why I suggested to make the shadow size a pref - it would work both for on/off and for size. _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] coding standards
by bulia byak 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

>on this. It would, however, be a good thing to have a consensus on the >coding standards by the end of the day today, so that we can put in some >man-hours on hitting FEB 1 release. Does that really stop us from e.g. fixing bugs? In any case, I don't have any strong feelings either way, so I will be fine with whatever you (i.e. those who do have strong feelings about this issue) decide. _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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page shadow
by bulia byak 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

Jon, I think it would be more convenient just to add a preferences value (e.g. options.pageshadow) for how large is the shadow, or no shadow if it is 0. Can you please do that? _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] coding standards
by bulia byak 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

>>http://paul.oniony.com/sections/information/tabsversusspaces.html > >I'm arguing for what he calls "Hybrid Indentation". I'd prefer it too. My XEmacs inserts tabs for me, and I don't really want to learn reconfiguring it. There are more interesting problems :) _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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SVG Patterns
by Alan Horkan 19 Jan '04

19 Jan '04

You mentioned SVG patterns and that you were having difficulty finding programs that used them. Jasc Web Draw 1.0 for Windows also implements SVG Patterns. http://www.jasc.com/products/webdraw/ You can download a trial version from the Jasc website (or you can be a little bit sneakier and skip the registration process by going elsewhere ftp://ftp2.jasc.com/pub/ I think this the link for Web Draw ftp://ftp2.jasc.com/pub/wdw102ev.exe ) I've dumped a copy of the patterns.svg file in this folder http://www.maths.tcd.ie/~horkana/inkscape/jascwebdraw/ SVG Patterns http://www.maths.tcd.ie/~horkana/inkscape/jascwebdraw/patterns.svg Hope that is of use. Sincerely Alan Horkan http://advogato.org/person/AlanHorkan/ PS this is a new post,sorry I couldn't maintain the thread

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Re: Patterns
by Bryce Harrington 18 Jan '04

18 Jan '04

On Tue, 23 Dec 2003, vellum wrote: > Hi Bryce, > > In the new year when the dust has settled I would like to pursue patterns in > Inkscape. I have been collecting and generating SVG code for several that I > would like to see in the program and will post them. Also, what about > generating specific patterns not present in the program? Would it be very > difficult to implement this in Inkscape? > > Vellum What we need to do for not only this but also markers and gradients is to have a "palette manager" thingee that allows the user to edit these kind of <def> items. There's three types of <def> items - "document level", "application level", and "external". Document level def's are stored in the document itself; currently this is the only type supported. Application level def's are defaults that will be provided by Inkscape itself; these are copied into the document if used, and removed if any all referring objects are deleted. External def's are specified with URI's and are not copied into the document at all, but instead looked up and loaded in memory at runtime; a command would be provided to the user to flatten external def's into document level def's. Bryce

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win build + tablet
by bulia byak 18 Jan '04

18 Jan '04

Bob, I tested your latest Windows builds on a win98 system with a Wacom tablet. Unfortunately it's almost unusable because it responds to perhaps 1/4 of all button_press and button_release events. Pressing harder does not help. Other Windows programs and all Linux programs on the same computer work fine. I suspect it's a GTK port problem, so my question is: do you know any other GTK program ported to Windows with the same libraries as you use, so I could test it and compare? _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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Re: page shadow
by bulia byak 18 Jan '04

18 Jan '04

>Is there a place in the source code you could recommend to me where I >can look at and copy another one? Lots of places now use prefs_get_int_attribute. E.g. tolerance value, scroll distances, etc. It's very simple in fact. The Wiki page was written for you :) >I suggested a pref value and other developers said save your time. Different people may prefer different shadow styles, so a preference is appropriate IMHO. _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] your nodepath changes
by bulia byak 18 Jan '04

18 Jan '04

>Got it. Added a method to return the node count of a nodepath. >Now when a node delete leaves <2 nodes, it considered the >same as if the whole thing was deleted. > >Tried both node_delete() and node_delete_segment() with ><2, 2, and >2 nodes. Seems to work OK. Looked in the XML >and didn't see any phantoms. Thank you, that works well. Although I would prefer the node tool to still be able to handle one-node path, and only delete it when you switch away from the node tool. So that e.g. I can leave one node and "draw" from it by pressing shift-d and arrow keys repeatedly. But perhaps it's not worth the extra trouble, and at least it's safer as you implemented it. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] your nodepath changes
by bulia byak 18 Jan '04

18 Jan '04

>>Still segfaults for one-node path: >Got that one, too. The segfault is fixed, but it still leaves a ghost path with empty d="" attribute which is impossible to delete except in the XML editor. Could you please change it so that if a single node remains, the path object is deleted when you switch away from node tool? This is consistent because if you delete all nodes but one in a subpath, then on the next entry into node tool, that subpath is gone. So I think we should do the same for the entire path, too. _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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cannot compile
by bulia byak 17 Jan '04

17 Jan '04

sp-symbol.cpp: In function `void sp_symbol_bbox(SPItem*, NRRect*, const NRMatrix*, unsigned int)': sp-symbol.cpp:466: error: cannot convert `NRMatrix' to `NRMatrix*' for argument `1' to `NRMatrix* nr_matrix_multiply(NRMatrix*, const NRMatrix*, const NRMatrix*)' sp-symbol.cpp:469: error: cannot convert `NRMatrix' to `const NRMatrix*' in argument passing sp-root.cpp: In function `void sp_root_bbox(SPItem*, NRRect*, const NRMatrix*, unsigned int)': sp-root.cpp:715: error: cannot convert `NRMatrix' to `NRMatrix*' for argument `1' to `NRMatrix* nr_matrix_multiply(NRMatrix*, const NRMatrix*, const NRMatrix*)' sp-root.cpp:718: error: cannot convert `NRMatrix' to `const NRMatrix*' in argument passing _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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MAX_PATH not safe
by Jon A. Cruz 17 Jan '04

17 Jan '04

Uh oh. Using MAX_PATH as an absolute turns out not to be safe. WINE's docs have this to say in regards to CreateFile > Windows NT: You can use paths longer than MAX_PATH characters by > calling the wide (W) version of CreateFile and prepending “\\?\” to > the path. The “\\?\” tells the function to turn off path parsing. This > lets you use paths that are nearly 32,000 Unicode characters long. You > must use fully-qualified paths with this technique. This also works > with UNC names. The “\\?\” is ignored as part of the path. IIRC, we have at least a few fixed buffers with MAX_PATH. 256 is a bit shy of 32767. =-O

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] your nodepath changes
by bulia byak 16 Jan '04

16 Jan '04

>Found it! Yayy! Still segfaults for one-node path: - create a path - f2 - select all nodes but one - del - f1 - f2 crash. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] your nodepath changes
by bulia byak 16 Jan '04

16 Jan '04

>- create a path > >- f2 > >- select all nodes > >- del > > >This creates a segfault, (apparently) because the nodepath was being >destroyed more than once. I remember doing exactly that, and it did not segfault, after I added the delete_selection. In fact that was _why_ I added delete_selection - previously this operation left a ghost path with no nodes which was impossible to pick or delete. So the segfault problem may have appeared more recently and not in my code (although I am not 100% sure). _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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Status for 2004-01-15
by Bryce Harrington 16 Jan '04

16 Jan '04

Thursday, January 15, 2004 Statistics Nov 15 Nov 29 Dec 15 Dec 31 Jan 15 ========== ====== ====== ====== ====== ====== Lifetime Rank on SourceForge: 4391 3676 2452 2444 1928 (68.5%) (73.6%) (82.4%) (82.5%) (86.1%) Max Week's Rank on SourceForge: 62 37 27 22 321 (99.6%) (99.8%) (99.8%) (99.9%) (97.5%) Total SF Page Views * 50,000 86,000 107,600 126,512 Total SF Downloads * 1700 3640 4,751 5,735 Total Freshmeat URL Hits 746 1121 2237 2567 2,958 Total Freshmeat Subscriptions 16 19 28 30 33 Lines of Code in src/: 115,901 116,970 132,134 165,664 166,914 Code lines 100,549 132,458 133,150 Comment line 11,591 12,234 12,468 Blank 20,559 21.540 21,929 Lines of Docs in doc/: 1,135 2,100 2,225 2,615 3,068 Lines of content in website: 1,173 1,624 2,090 2,261 2,885 Size of the Inkscape wiki: 3,700 5,737 7,385 11,062 11,284 Hours since last ChangeLog mod: 6 2 21 0.8 0.1 Bugs open/total: 9/15 40/51 67/111 66/130 74/160 Features open/total: 18/18 23/24 40/45 103/115 104/120 Patches open/total: 1/ 6 5/20 6/25 4/32 4/32 CVS Commits (as per inkscape-cvs): 481 963 * 1580 * Inkscape-devel membership: 49 61 64 65 64 Inkscape-announce membership: 9 14 16 20 22 * - Statistics unavailable

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your nodepath changes
by bulia byak 16 Jan '04

16 Jan '04

Bob, I think your latest changes may result in invalid SVG (which is why I inserted nodepath_destroy and delete_selection in the first place). E.g.: - create a path - f2 - select all nodes but one - del - f1 The statusbar says "Path (0 nodes)", and in XML editor, you will see a <path> with an empty d= attribute. I believe this is invalid SVG, and in any case it's better to avoid such situations. Which is why I added deleting a nodepath which has only one node left. Please fix this somehow. Also, your new command "split path between nodes" gives too generic statusbar error messages. It only works for two adjacent nodes none of which is an end node of a subpath, but when some of these requirements is not met it simply says "You must select two nodes on a path". Please provide more specific diagnostics for non-adjacent nodes, end nodes, more than two nodes, etc. It might be useful to generalize this command so it would work on any number of adjacent nodes by first deleting all middle nodes and then removing the segment between the remaining two selected nodes. Your tooltip says "Split a path..." - first, it should be simply "Split path"; second, all other tooltips for node tool refer to "lines" but I believe "path" is better, so could you please edit other tooltips too, replacing "lines" by "paths"? _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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UserManual
by Cédric GEMY 15 Jan '04

15 Jan '04

Adding news to the last post about the UserManual, In fact the Manual I'm working on is still be written for Sodipodi. I'm working these days on an englo-us translation. There will be few things to do : 1. Improve the translations because my english is really crap; 2. Add Special Inkscape infos to the files (or think of a complete separate manual); 3. Go on writing pages : I'v thought about a beginning tutorial that I'll be working on as soon as my translation will be given for improvement. I'm open to all kind of ideas. Cédric

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middle button click, zooming news
by bulia byak 15 Jan '04

15 Jan '04

I have enabled middle button click to zoom in or (with Shift) out. This is in addition to middle button drag which pans the canvas as before. This works in all tools. The zoom increment (used by all zoom methods) is now stored in the preferences [options.zoomincrement]. I also changed the algorithm of zooming in/out on click. Previously, the point you clicked on was centered in the window after zoom. Now it remains under your mouse, i.e. you can position mouse over the object you're interested in and click several times in a row to zoom into it without having to move your mouse, even if that object is not in the center of window. I think it's much more convenient this way. _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] SPOffset standards considerations
by bulia byak 15 Jan '04

15 Jan '04

> 1. use our own inkscape:href (or something like that) attribute instead >of xlink:href for linked offsets -- SVG does not define xlink:href to >have meaning for <path> elements. Yes > 2. populate the d= attribute of the SPOffset <path> with the offset >path, so the SVG requirements are satisfied, and normal SVG UAs have >something to render. Doesn't it do that already? >[ a ground rule here is that an Inkscape document should look no >different in a pure SVG UA than in Inkscape -- at minimum, when in >doubt, check how it looks in Batik ] Yes > 3. All of the SPOffset extension attributes need to be in the inkscape >namespace, not the sodipodi namespace (e.g. inkscape:original, not >sodipodi:original). The sodipodi namespace is reserved for Sodipodi's >use. This holds true for all new functionality we add. Yes, I wrote about that >As interoperability and standards-compliance are core goals for us, I >can't sign off on an 0.37 release until these are fixed. But I think they are really easy to fix :) _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/features&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin…

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RE: Scrolling Idea for inkscape
by bulia byak 15 Jan '04

15 Jan '04

>(18:01:59) rejon: feels like the zooming position should be based on the >canvas/page size No, I think +/- zooming should always zoom to the center of view, as it does now. Taking into account the canvas is unreliable, because your drawing may be smaller or larger than the canvas. >unless zoomed in with the mouse scrollwheel, in which >case the point from which the zoom is performed would be the current >mouse x/y position Yes, any click-zoom (be that wheel, zoom tool, etc) must zoom into the mouse point position. Report a bug if that ain't so. _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] new offset commands
by bulia byak 15 Jan '04

15 Jan '04

>Further extensions to make this an uber tool: > >There needs to be a 'convert to path' dynamic tool, which maintains a path >converted from the original shape (spiral, oval etc) so that the user can >edit the handles on the original shape. That is, a spiral can be the parent of a path, and the path, the parent of an offset - so the spiral can affect the offset without becoming a path? That might be cool indeed. >Rather than defaulting to 'cap', outset should allow the user to choose >between the 3 corner choices, cap, mitre and bevel. Simply use the cap/join settings of the shape being offset >Why does the path always get closed? I can't see any justification for >this in the algorithm? Agreed >Why does a crossed (self intersecting) path get 'unwound' when making >outset? I would have thought that a reasonable definition would be 'the >curve n pixels to the left of this curve as I walk in the standard >direction'. This would remove some of the abiguity I think? Intuitively, when I have a shape with a hole, I expect outset to close this hole and inset to make it bigger. This is what the current algorithm does. _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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SPOffset standards considerations
by MenTaLguY 15 Jan '04

15 Jan '04

Congratulations on all the great work that's going on with the offset stuff. It's a very useful feature! However... Currently, an Inkscape SVG document using SPOffsets will not render properly in other conformant SVG user agents. This is not good. To remedy this: 1. use our own inkscape:href (or something like that) attribute instead of xlink:href for linked offsets -- SVG does not define xlink:href to have meaning for <path> elements. 2. populate the d= attribute of the SPOffset <path> with the offset path, so the SVG requirements are satisfied, and normal SVG UAs have something to render. [ a ground rule here is that an Inkscape document should look no different in a pure SVG UA than in Inkscape -- at minimum, when in doubt, check how it looks in Batik ] 3. All of the SPOffset extension attributes need to be in the inkscape namespace, not the sodipodi namespace (e.g. inkscape:original, not sodipodi:original). The sodipodi namespace is reserved for Sodipodi's use. This holds true for all new functionality we add. As interoperability and standards-compliance are core goals for us, I can't sign off on an 0.37 release until these are fixed. -mental

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sorry to be so wordy!
by Jonathan Phillips 15 Jan '04

15 Jan '04

Inkscape, with dynamic offset, linked offset and the new node UI tweaks is very rockin' now to design with. I can literally churn out new graphics with it. Great work guys! The Boolean Ops and color palette are so excellent to work with now. GR8 WORK! Jon -- Jonathan Phillips <jon@...15...>

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Re: new offset commands
by bulia byak 15 Jan '04

15 Jan '04

> > - The simple Inset/Outset commands must check if the > > object is already an > > SPOffset, and if so, adjust its radius instead of > > converting it to shapes. > >the offset of an offset of shape A is not in general >another offset of A. what you want is mathematically >incorrect, but maybe what the user expects... That is, you mean that several sequential simple offsets of a path will give a different result than several sequential adjustments of an SPOffset radius? If so that is unfortunate, but if there's no mathematical workaround for this problem, I would still argue that the above described behavior is the most logical. An SPOffset is a higher level of abstraction than a path; if we can perform some operation without lowering the level of abstraction, we must do that, if only because lowering the level of abstraction is generally irreversible. > > - The dynamic offsets do not accept zero radius; > > they snap it to +/- 0.25, > > so you cannot do an exact copy of the original. Why > > this limitation? I tried > >0 width will cause problems, and imposing a minimum >radius was the simplest way around; besides what's the >point of doing a 0 offset? The point is that when I have an SPOffset, I normally use node tool to adjust its radius, and I don't want to have any preset value - I want to start from zero. Another point is that it's not clean to have different inset/outset commands for different offset types; it's much more logical to have one pair of inset/outset commands that act on any objects plus several commands that create (but not adjust) different kinds of offset objects. It's just a matter of a clean separation of concepts. And finally, an object with a parameter that cannot take one specific value (even though this value makes sense for it) is a lack of genericity and looks more like a bug to me. So, can you just add a special-case treatment in SPObject so that if radius is 0 (or very close to 0), it simply copies the original path without attempting any offset? _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/photos&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjo…

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new offset commands
by bulia byak 15 Jan '04

15 Jan '04

I added two new commands to the Path menu: Dynamic offset and Linked offset. Now simple Inset/Outset commands work on paths, and the two new commands create an "offset object" that can be dynamically adjusted by the node tool. The difference between them is that Dynamic offset transforms the selected object into an offset, while Linked offset adds a new offset object that is linked to the original path, so you can edit the original path and its linked offset will be updated. This is a very powerful tool and I'm really excited about it. Fred, there are some remaining problems where we need your help. It would be great to have them fixed for the upcoming release: - It appears that all offsets now use the imprecise algorithm (you once mentioned that there were two algorithms, one precise but slow and the othe imprecise but fast). I think we should use the precise algorithm for all kinds of offsets, dynamic or not. - The simple Inset/Outset commands must check if the object is already an SPOffset, and if so, adjust its radius instead of converting it to shapes. - The dynamic offsets do not accept zero radius; they snap it to +/- 0.25, so you cannot do an exact copy of the original. Why this limitation? I tried removing if (fabs (offset->rad) < 0.25) offset->rad = (offset->rad < 0) ? -0.25 : 0.25; in sp-offset.cpp but then setting zero radius caused the program to freeze. Is this a limitation of the algorithm? _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] Snap Control
by bulia byak 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

>Technically, while it's in the user manual, the user manual is in >French, and the English translation is very incomplete. Also note that >the manual was written for Sodipodi rather than Inkscape, so does not >yet address the new user interface, etc. I think it would be easier just to start over using Wiki. Whenever anyone has got a good idea (not necessarily 100% complete or even correct) of how some command, tool, dialog etc works, just take a couple minutes to visit Wiki and share your knowledge (on a page under User Documentation Scratchpad). Or when you have nothing better to do, edit and unify other's notes, add screenshots, etc. _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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RE: [Fwd: RE: [Inkscape-devel] Re: new offset commands]
by bulia byak 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

>I wonder though if it should keep the inverse and also have a black >border with an outer white border. It is much better, but still gets >lost sometimes. Thoughts? The outer white border, like on the mouse >pointer helps sooo much to pop out small nodes against dark colors. Double borders? Hmm, that's something even Inkscape cannot handle without some additional coding... Still, consider that we now have an edge over both Xara (which has inversion but no border in its knots) and Illustrator (which has border but no inversion). _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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[Fwd: RE: [Inkscape-devel] Re: new offset commands]
by Jonathan Phillips 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

Needless to say...Bulia, you are the shit! Cool! That is about a 1000X improvment on editing... I wonder though if it should keep the inverse and also have a black border with an outer white border. It is much better, but still gets lost sometimes. Thoughts? The outer white border, like on the mouse pointer helps sooo much to pop out small nodes against dark colors. Great WORK! Jon On Wed, 2004-01-14 at 13:42, bulia byak wrote: > >I think the node to edit the dynamic offset though should be black with > >white outline. Does anyone know how to change this. I think it is a > >major usability problem, seeming that our normal shapes on startup have > >a black border which renders this node invisible. > > I fixed this for the shapes' handles in node edit (offset, rect, spiral, > etc). They are now inverse, i.e. always visible. And even better than that, > they have a light gray but not inverse border, which helps if they are over > a 50% gray or when two knots are on top of each other. In other words, it's > now simply impossible to render a knot invisible no matter what is the > background. The path nodes are also made more bright and visible, and the > nodes and control handles are more different. Please report your experience. > > What strikes me most is that the code for showing knots in inverse was > already there, although not used. All I did is changed some flags and > adjusted colors. It never ceases to amaze me how much effort was put by > Sodipodi author into the program internals but how little he cared about > making this stuff actually usable. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. > http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/features&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin… -- Jonathan Phillips <jon@...15...>

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] USERMANUAL + ICONS
by bulia byak 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

>Is anyone familiar with the procedure on how to design and implement new >icons in the Inkscape Interface? It would be helpful if someone (bulia? >ahem... :) ) could take the time to lay-out how to do this for some >newbies to the project (DEFENDGUIN, myself, etc). My opinion on the desirable icon style is here: http://www.inkscape.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?IconsStyle Other than that, it's difficult to give advice. All I can say is that e.g. the group/ungroup and z-order icons are ugly and noisy, while the flip icons are OK. Icons IMHO must be simple and laconic, not "realistic" or "3D". Just go on and try to draw something and we'll comment :) As for the procedure, I think you draw new icons in glade/icons.svg, group each icon and assign an id= attribute to the <g> in the XML editor, and then you specify that id for the corresponding verb in verbs.cpp (the last component of each line of props[]). But I never tried that so I may be wrong. Try it and document what you find out. _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] Re: new offset commands
by bulia byak 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

>I think the node to edit the dynamic offset though should be black with >white outline. Does anyone know how to change this. I think it is a >major usability problem, seeming that our normal shapes on startup have >a black border which renders this node invisible. I fixed this for the shapes' handles in node edit (offset, rect, spiral, etc). They are now inverse, i.e. always visible. And even better than that, they have a light gray but not inverse border, which helps if they are over a 50% gray or when two knots are on top of each other. In other words, it's now simply impossible to render a knot invisible no matter what is the background. The path nodes are also made more bright and visible, and the nodes and control handles are more different. Please report your experience. What strikes me most is that the code for showing knots in inverse was already there, although not used. All I did is changed some flags and adjusted colors. It never ceases to amaze me how much effort was put by Sodipodi author into the program internals but how little he cared about making this stuff actually usable. _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/features&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin…

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USERMANUAL + ICONS
by Jonathan Phillips 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

Hello All, I've added a UserManual page to the wiki to at least facilitate this discussion and move us forward on developing this. Please take some time to think about the manual, possible time-schedule on the development of this, etc. http://inkscape.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?UserManual Also, DEFENDGUIN and others have been asking about ICON development. We need to figure out where we stand on this? Do we want to develop ALL new icons, or replace some existing ones, or fill-in the ones we don't have completed? http://inkscape.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Icons Is anyone familiar with the procedure on how to design and implement new icons in the Inkscape Interface? It would be helpful if someone (bulia? ahem... :) ) could take the time to lay-out how to do this for some newbies to the project (DEFENDGUIN, myself, etc). Thanks, Jon -- Jonathan Phillips <jon@...15...>

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] Re: new offset commands
by bulia byak 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

>conversion touched a big portion of the code. you can >report any strange behavior in boolean operations and >offset to me. OK, see this bug: https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=877019&group_id=9… The outline in splotch-bad.svg is really weird! Even though splotch-good.svg is OK - that's the old file I created a couple weeks ago (so I cannot quite understand how that can be - surely it does not store the algorithm in SVG??) And I had to reopen this old bug too, because the splotch is back: https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=866838&group_id=9… _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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RE: Win32 Preferences
by bulia byak 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

>However, each new Win32 build puts in a new "preferences.xml" >file with each installation. When does it overwrite it - during installation? If so I think it's the installer problem, it should keep the old pref file and use it. On Linux, all my builds use the same pref file; if some new preference was added by a build, it gets merged into the old preferences.xml. Probably the problem is caused by the win build storing its preferences in the program dir (I think) instead of the home dir. I will now commit a fix which you'll need to test on windows. I'm not sure g_get_home_dir() works on windows, but if it does, it's the correct way to solve the problem. It should return the dir in your $HOME environment variable, and if there's none, I think it will return C:\. _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] screenshot-ready
by bulia byak 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

>Also, it seems like the status bar text should be vertically aligned in >the center to flow with vertical alignment with the other elements at >the bottom of the document window. I now limited the height of the entire bottom bar to 20 pixels which gave a slightly better vertical alignment of things. Please check on your system. _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] screenshot-ready
by bulia byak 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

>Could we supply an option for screensize as either pecentage or pixels? >It makes sense and is a good suggestion. Why not, if the size is specified with % at the end, it would refer to the screen percentage. Please submit an RFE. _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/photos&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjo…

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Re: Any news on inkscape?
by Wolfram Quester 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

Hi Jordi! On Thu, Jan 08, 2004 at 06:30:41PM +0100, Jordi Mallach wrote: > Hi Wolfi, > > Any news on the inkscape packages? I'm very interested in having this > app available. > > Jordi I cc the inkscape-devel list, so they know the status of the packages also. Guido Günther did the upload of my 0.36-packages around Christmas (26. I think), so they should appear in unstable sooner or later. I thought about making two packages: One called inkscape and cvs-snapshots in inkscape-cvs. cvs-snapshots could be packaged every two or three weeks with a dummy bug open to keep them in unstable. I didn't upload a cvs-snapshot yet. Best regards, Wolfi

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remember update the ChangeLog!
by MenTaLguY 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

This is just a reminder to update the ChangeLog file whenever you commit something to CVS! This is really important! Otherwise at minimum it's hard for everyone to see what everyone else is working on. -mental

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] Using gtkmm in inkscape
by bulia byak 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

> > The metric I'm watching for this is the size of the inkscape-devel > > mailing list; when it hits 200-300 I will assume we're at the sweet > > spot. Based on the volume of list traffic I think we're already pretty > > close. :-) I can understand the 200-300 as the ideal size of the developer community, but users? They don't have to be a community at all, and any attempts to limit their number seem utterly weird to me. I am not very excited to think that my work will be used by no more than 300 people in the whole world. _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] screenshot-ready
by bulia byak 14 Jan '04

14 Jan '04

>Why don't you just get the size of the screen and take a percentage of >it? like make it 2/3 screen width and 2/3 screen height. > >Make it so that people on large displays don't end up having to resize >the window every time? The idea is to store the size in preferences, and therefore it must be a fixed number, not some algorithm. Users will be able to set this size for newly created documents in preferences; in saved & loaded documents it is saved with the document and restored automatically. _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] screenshot-ready
by bulia byak 13 Jan '04

13 Jan '04

One more thing I forgot: now the default window size of a new document is 640x480 (set in preferences-skeleton.h). Can anyone argue for better values? We need to set it there because: - the default size without it is determined by the width of the menu and the height of the toolbar, and is way too small, - we need to provide a template that users could edit in their preferences.xml to set the window size they prefer. _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] Using gtkmm in inkscape
by bulia byak 13 Jan '04

13 Jan '04

Nathan, let me respectfully disagree. >Jon, we _DON'T_ want lots of users just yet. Look what happens when you >get lots of users: they complain about features not being available; Which is valuable. We cannot invent everything. >they complain that the interface isn't exactly like their favourite program >XYZ; Which is valuable. We cannot know all existing programs inside out, so why not use this help. >they clutter mailing lists up with questions answered already in the FAQ or >user manual(which we haven't even written yet); More incentive to write it. Or would you prefer writing to a nonexisting audience? This sounds like a perversion to me :) >and you spend the whole time worrying about fixing code to compile on >borland visual gcc 2.96. First, _users_ don't usually tweak with compiling. Second, just set a standard set of requirements/platforms (what you are doing now) and don't care about everything else. And third, it's just as likely that someone will come up with, "Hey, I know you don't support it, but I managed to compile on XYZ, here's the patch." >Can we stop treating this as a commercial project whose main aim is to >maximise user base? I've been on such projects before, and they usually >die a horrible death. If a project has managed to gain a good user base, it doesn't already sound like "horrible death" to me, regardless of what lies ahead. Projects that die _without_ users look much more pitiful. _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] [Fwd: Re: [Sodipodi-list] Visual cue for multiple selection
by bulia byak 13 Jan '04

13 Jan '04

> > My only concern is what do you do when there are more than like 20 > > objects selected at once? Don't you think at a certain point the amount > > of sub-bounding boxes would be overwhelming? > >That is possible. It has never bothered me in the past, but we'll have to >see how we get on. Perhaps we could increase the transparency of the >boxes as the number of items increases, or something. See my comment here: https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=875727&group_id=9… In short: I'm against boxes (messy!) but individual items in a selection can and should be marked somehow, for example as Xara does that by adding a small inverted square (like a handle but smaller) at the top left corner of each object's bounding box. _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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[Fwd: Re: [Sodipodi-list] Visual cue for multiple selections]
by Jonathan Phillips 13 Jan '04

13 Jan '04

-----Forwarded Message----- From: Carl Hetherington <lists@...169...> To: Lauris Kaplinski <lauris@...39...> Cc: sodipodi-list(a)lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Sodipodi-list] Visual cue for multiple selections Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 15:40:23 +0000 On Mon, 12 Jan 2004, Lauris Kaplinski wrote: > Hello! [snip] > It may be clear for 2-4 items, but may become visual hodgepodge > if you have, say 20 items. > As far as I remember, CorelDraw painted tiny anchor dot for > each object selected. This may be alternative approach - there > even is no need to choose either one, if we can make these > configurable. OK. Seeing the bounding boxes of a large selection never really bothered me, but I can see how it would be bad in some circumstances. In order to demonstrate the idea, I've submitted a patch to the sf.net patch tracker which puts red bounding boxes around selected items. It's a diff against current CVS. I'd be interested in any thoughts. I think the immediate to-do list is: 1. make it optional. 2. decide how to choose a colour for the item bounding boxes. 3. make it more efficient. I'd be pleased to hear any comments or thoughts. Cheers Carl ------------------------------------------------------- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Perforce Software. Perforce is the Fast Software Configuration Management System offering advanced branching capabilities and atomic changes on 50+ platforms. Free Eval! http://www.perforce.com/perforce/loadprog.html _______________________________________________ Sodipodi-list mailing list Sodipodi-list(a)lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/sodipodi-list -- Jonathan Phillips <jon@...15...>

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[Fwd: Re: [Sodipodi-list] Visual cue for multiple selections]
by Jonathan Phillips 13 Jan '04

13 Jan '04

-----Forwarded Message----- From: Carl Hetherington <lists@...169...> To: Jonathan Phillips <jon@...15...> Subject: Re: [Sodipodi-list] Visual cue for multiple selections Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 15:43:48 +0000 Hi Jonathan, On Mon, 12 Jan 2004, Jonathan Phillips wrote: > We would love it if you worked on this problem in INKSCAPE. We've been > discussing it and I've added your request to the INKSCAPE RFE. It is a > good idea. > > www.inkscape.org (join our developers list!) > > My only concern is what do you do when there are more than like 20 > objects selected at once? Don't you think at a certain point the amount > of sub-bounding boxes would be overwhelming? That is possible. It has never bothered me in the past, but we'll have to see how we get on. Perhaps we could increase the transparency of the boxes as the number of items increases, or something. > I'm not trying to steal you away from sodipodi, but I think that you > will find our development community is more supportive of direct > changes/revisions to the codebase. Come check us out... Looks good :-) The fact that the inkscape toolbars are docked to the main window gives you an instant 1-0 lead! (especially since I'm using Windows) I haven't got around to compiling inkscape yet, but it looks like the patch I just submitted to the sodipodi patch tracker should apply to inkscape as well. It's only a "first cut", but it gives you the idea. Cheers Carl -- Jonathan Phillips <jon@...15...>

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] Using gtkmm in inkscape
by bulia byak 13 Jan '04

13 Jan '04

>done." This means that if a decision is between more users or easier for >developers, I say we take the easier for developers option. Choices of this kind are fortunately rare. Normally we can all focus on our areas of interest (e.g. the usability for me or program internals for you) without stepping on each other's toes. >In this case it means using gtkmm _despite_ it not being available in large >quantities. I'm no expert but I got the impression that gtkmm availability is being resolved, so the point is moot. > In this case it means not holding back a feature because it makes the >windows port hard. Can you give an example of such a feature? >In this case it means throwing away a large chunk of UI code because it was >clumsy. Are you referring to the spiral tool? If so, what's so clumsy about it? >Otherwise we will decend to the point where all we are doing is minor >tweaks to the about box... :-) _Someone_ must do these tweaks, too. _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/photos&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjo…

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gtkmm in MacOS X Fink, maybe
by unknown＠example.com 13 Jan '04

13 Jan '04

This might be what you need. I think someone added it yesterday: http://fink.sourceforge.net/pdb/package.php/gtkmm2 Murray Cumming www.murrayc.com murrayc@...167...

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] Using gtkmm in inkscape
by unknown＠example.com 13 Jan '04

13 Jan '04

> However, freshrpms does have a 9.0 package that installs on 8.0. But > again, it's a bit problematic for those individuals and companies who > haven't stayed on the cutting edge. Fedora.us has gtkmm rpms, so you should use them instead, because they are official. They are basically the same as the fedora.us gtkmm rpms for Fedora Core 1. Murray Cumming www.murrayc.com murrayc@...167...

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Using gtkmm in inkscape
by unknown＠example.com 13 Jan '04

13 Jan '04

Hi, someone pointed this status page out to me: http://www.inkscape.org/status/status_20031231.php So I thought I would offer some advice, quoting that page: > A second and much more critical issue has been raised regarding Gtkmm. > As planned since early in the project, we began incorporating Gtkmm > into Inkscape following the 0.36 release. Quickly it became evident > that this introduced severe dependency issues. > Gtkmm 2.x is not available commonly on most Linux distros. It is easily available for debian and RedHat/Fedora, from official distro sources: http://www.gtkmm.org/download.shtml A Mandrake developer assured me that they would ship it, but I don't have a Mandrake installation and I don't know how to check that. I'm fairly sure that it's easily available for Gentoo. SUSE have no public bug tracking or feedback system that I know of, but hopefully that will get better. With no contributions system, you will have difficult installing Inkscape on SUSE whether or not you need gtkmm. What other distros are you interested in? > On Windows it adds to the DLL download weight. I'm not sure what significance the download size has these days. By the way, gtkmm is easily installable on Windows: http://www.gtkmm.org/download.shtml > Most distressingly, it isn't yet ported to OSX. It builds, and works, and Julian Missig built a darwinports package: http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gtkmm-list/2003-December/msg00122.html I don't know much about MacOS X these days, but I suspect that you want it as a Fink package. That should not be at all difficult to do. Please tell ask on the gtkmm-list if you need help with that. I would appreciate being CCed on any communication with the Fink people. Murray Cumming www.murrayc.com murrayc@...167...

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] Using gtkmm in inkscape
by unknown＠example.com 12 Jan '04

12 Jan '04

> We can't > expect customers to have recent versions of anything, If they can get your application, then they can get your application's dependencies. It has not always been easy to get either applicatins or their dependencies but it's getting better now that Fedora is official. > nor > can we expect them to upgrade. Why shouldn't they upgrade? If the dependencies have stable API and ABIs then there is no reason not to upgrade the depenencies. Murray Cumming www.murrayc.com murrayc@...167...

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] Using gtkmm in inkscape
by unknown＠example.com 12 Jan '04

12 Jan '04

> Of course it is available. The question is, "Is it already > there?" The average blue-haired old lady might be puzzled a > bit by a dialog: "You must have gtkmm-2.4-x.rpm installed for > Inkscape to work" 'RPM Hell' is becoming a major part of the > Download Factor. But, on sane systems such as debian's apt and RedHat/Fedora's new thingy, and others, you will just install Inkscape and it will take care of the rest. People will not even know, or care, that you use gtkmm. > >>On Windows it adds to the DLL download weight. > >> > >> > > > >I'm not sure what significance the download size has these > days. By the > >way, gtkmm is easily installable on Windows: > >http://www.gtkmm.org/download.shtml > > > > > > This is the other major part. Every little bit hurts. If > we need it, > include it. Using, or not using, gtkmm is not the sort of major decision that should hinge on a little bit of download size. And as someone else said in another thread, people are quite used to enormous Windows downloads, because everyone has to ship all of MFC, CommonDialogs, yadda yadda in every application installer. Murray Cumming www.murrayc.com murrayc@...167...

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] Using gtkmm in inkscape
by unknown＠example.com 12 Jan '04

12 Jan '04

> I have a question, something we were talking about a week > ago. Is it possible to build recent versions of gtkmm and > sigc++ with not-so-recent versions of Gtk, Glib, and the > like? libsigc++ does not depend on GTK+ or glib. gtkmm 2.2 can build with GTK+ 2.2 and glib 2.2, and with later API/ABI-compatible versions such as GTK+ 2.3/2.4. gtkmm 2.4 requires GTK+ 2.4 (2.3 will become 2.4). Gtkmm 2.4 installs in parallel with gtkmm 2.2, so you can have both: http://www.gtkmm.org/ > It would be good if we could limit the wildcards of > the distro to only those two libs. glibmm is now a separate module, for gtkmm 2.4. Murray Cumming www.murrayc.com murrayc@...167...

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Rendering Plugin: GtkMathView
by Felix Breuer 12 Jan '04

12 Jan '04

Hello Inkscape Hackers! I have a couple of questions: In general: Does the planned plugin architechture of Inkscape allow for rendering plugins, i.e. plugins that render new/custom/other tags in the SVG document (embedded via the foreignObject tag)? More specifically: I would really like a MathML rendering plugin. Does your (planned) plugin architechture allow for such a thing? If it does, my suggestion is the following: GtkMathView [1] is a very mature MathML rendering engine which provides a) a GTK rendering widget, b) a C++ interface for rendering MathML and, most importantly, a Bonobo component. For details see [1]. It might be possible to use this to render MathML formulas inside pictures/diagramms created with Inkscape without too much implementation effort (?). Rationale: Currently there is no modern visual software to create mathematical/technical drawings. The free software user who needs such drawings (i.e. drawings that contain formulas) is forced to use programms like Xfig or to hand-code these drawings in LaTeX. Neither approach suits me and most of the mathematicians I know rather stick to pen and paper because of that. Hence, I think there is a not-too-small community of people who would be interested in this feature. If you think this is feasible with regard to Inkscape's plugin architechture, I might well take to the task of implementing the actual plugin. Please tell me what you think. Regards, Felix

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Dependencies, GTKmm, Windows and autopackage
by Mike Hearn 12 Jan '04

12 Jan '04

That's a bit of a mouthful of a subject line, isn't it? Let me introduce myself. I'm the maintainer of the autopackage project (http://autopackage.org/) which is focussed on making software installation on Linux as easy as it is on other platforms. There are several parts to that mission, but autopackage is one of the first - it's a way of building packages that can be installed on any distribution *with* dependency handling. The idea is that maintainers of applications and libraries build a binary package at the same time as releasing source code packages, so ensuring that end users need not compile from the source. A few things that autopackage is: - A framework for building distro-neutral installers - A system that checks the OS directly for any dependencies required, so you don't have to use autopackage to install dependencies: it will detect their presence regardless of whether RPM, source code or simply copying binaries from another machine was used. - Currently experimental. We're about to release 0.4. All packages built until we release 1.0 are classed as experimental too. - Distributed: autopackage does not depend on having large repositories of packages built from it. The idea is that maintainers host packages themselves, and packages know where to go and find them to resolve dependencies. A few things autopackage is not: - It's not a distro. The idea is not that we package everything - far from it, all the packages we produce currently (there are only a few) are for testing purposes only. - It's not a replacement for RPM. For version 0.6/0.7 we want to integrate support for using native RPMs/DEBs/ebuilds where they exist, and utilising the native dep resolver when possible. Why is this relevant to Inkscape? I noticed on your last status report that you were considering delaying the introduction of GTKmm because it was not widely spread enough amongst distros. This is problematic, as the reason it's not installed by default in most distros is the lack of popular apps using it. One of the reasons people are reluctant to use it, is the lack of distros which include it. Clearly this is a catch-22 situation. So what is the answer? autopackage 0.4, which features network dependency retrieval, is going to be released soon. After that comes 0.5, in which we don't really want to add new features but instead concentrate on packaging a reasonably complex real world application. Up until now we've been using Gaim, which works OK but the Gaim maintainers have been less than co-operative so we're scouting around for something else (which preferably uses language bindings) to package instead. Programs that use language bindings are primary targets for us, because the dependency problems caused by them often discourage people from using them. This is not good, because language bindings have the potential to dramatically increase the productivity of free software developers by letting us get away from C. Therefore, I want people to use them, therefore I want people to depend on them. I have a proposal: If you go ahead with your original plans to make full use of GTKmm and all the useful things it provides, for 0.5 we will package Inkscape and GTKmm together in a distro-neutral fashion. You can link to these packages from your website, as well as providing packages in any other form you like. If up to date RPMs, DEBs etc are not available for the users distro, they can try the .package (autopackage) files. They will scan the system for GTKmm and other deps, and download and install them if not found. Here is a quick attempt to address some questions I expect you have. Q: But there are other reasons we are wary of GTKmm! A: Yes. The maintainer of GTKmm is not aware of any building problems on MacOS X however - being standard C++ and given that Apple use gcc, it's hard to imagine where potential problems might come from. Certainly, it would not be hard to port if there were issues. I'm not sure this is a valid reason to avoid GTKmm: if people want to use Inkscape on MacOS then any issues (if there are any) will be worked out. Murray Cumming can comment more on this. DLL bloat: all I can say here is that many, many win32 applications ship with MFC or ATL DLLs so this is hardly a problem unique to ported applications. Certainly the benefits of a good C++ wrapper outweigh the additional download size IMHO. Q: Isn't Linux binary portability really bad? A: Well, yes and no. A part of the work we do for autopackage is R&D into Linux binary portability. You're almost certainly aware of the C++ ABI break, about which we can do nothing. Fortunately gcc 2.95 is several years old now and *all* modern distros are compiled with gcc 3.2, so this is not so problematic (though autopackage can detect and deal with it nonetheless). There are other issues, of course. We have some simple drop-in build tools to control glibc symbol versions, the package build program scans all ELF binaries to locate common mistakes, and so on. In order to improve the binary portability between Linux distros, minor changes to the build system and/or source may be necessary. They should not affect the functionality of the program in any way. Q: Where does Windows come into this? A: You want a Win32 port. As you have already discovered ..... http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=841633&group_id=93… .... Win32 binaries are always binary relocatable, whereas Linux binaries often are not. Inkscape is typical in that it contains constructs of the form: open_file( INKSCAPE_GLADE_DIR "/foo.png" ) or whatever, ie the path to the binary is constructed at compile time, not runtime. In other words, it's source but not binary relocatable. A minimum requirement of software packaged using autopackage is that it must be binary relocatable. There are several use cases for why this is good - from people who want to install to their home directory (autopackage allows them to do this automatically), to people who ran out of space on / and added a new harddisk, to admins installing to network mountpoints. This is not so trivial on Linux because there is no equivalent to the Win32 GetModuleFileName() call. Fortunately, as part of developing autopackage we have written a simple C file that can be dropped into any program or library and used to determine the prefix at runtime. This file is Linux specific (it reads /proc) but it can be switched on/off automatically in the configure script. Ports to other platforms will be added as time goes by. binreloc, as we call it, is really easy to use. It redefines the standard macros, so you can replace: open( DATA_DIR "/foo.png" ); with open( DATA_DIR("/foo.png") ); That's it! TLS slots are used to ensure there are no memory leaks. You already need to remove hard-coded prefixes like that from the code for the Win32 port to be really robust. At the same time, it can be done for Linux. If you aren't wanting to do this straight away, I might be able to write a patch to do it using binreloc. I also hack on Wine (my other project) so hopefully making it work for Win32 as well wouldn't be too hard. Q: But GTKmm is already packaged for Fedora and Debian. Users will want to use them, not the autopackage versions! A: Sure, we know that. At the moment autopackage can only fulfil missing dependencies using its own packages. In the 0.6/0.7 timeframe we want to add support for at minimum apt, and probably also yum and maybe urpmi so users will get the packages designed specifically for their distro instead of the generic ones. Q: What about GTK 2.2 vs GTK 2.0? A: Yeah, maybe. We're kind of reluctant to package GTK itself as that's really the distributors job - GTK is a core OS component these days. Linux is moving so fast at the moment that to be able to use new software I think it's reasonable to expect people to be upgrading their distros. Supporting one previous version is probably OK, supporting a year old distro is pushing things a bit. Still, there's no theoretical reason why we can't build GTK autopackages if the demand is there. Most people would want to at least wait until we integrate better with RPM before upgrading their system like that. If you have other questions about autopackage specifically, then see the autopackage FAQ: http://www.autopackage.org/faq.html In summary, my proposal is simple: * You continue the original plan of using GTKmm and reap the productivity benefits. Murray is chatting to the fink guys, so hopefully MacOS X worries should soon be dealt with. * We build Linux distro-neutral packages of Inkscape and GTKmm for the autopackage 0.5 milestone. We host them on our servers. * You link to them from your website. This lets people who don't have GTKmm packages available natively for their distro install Inkscape binaries anyway. * We maintain them until autopackage reaches version 1. At this point we don't want to maintain packages anymore, and will be pushing out all the specfiles we were testing with to the community and maintainers. At this point you can decide whether the test packages were popular enough to warrant continuing with autopackage. Apologies for the overlong email, but I wanted you guys to have some context. What do you think? thanks -mike

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Request breaking CVS lock
by Peter Moulder 12 Jan '04

12 Jan '04

A cvs -d ':ext:pjrm@...54...:/cvsroot/inkscape' admin -ko many-files... command segfaulted, apparently leaving locks in place. According to *see (cvs)Concurrency: If a lock seems to stick around for an undue amount of time, find the person holding the lock and ask them about the cvs command they are running. If they aren't running a cvs command, look in the repository directory mentioned in the message and remove files which they own whose names start with `#cvs.rfl', `#cvs.wfl', or `#cvs.lock'. Can you please remove all such files owned by pjrm (me) in inkscape's CVS repository? Thanks, pjrm.

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] new keys for the panel
by bulia byak 11 Jan '04

11 Jan '04

>Here's a readers' digest summary of how Inkscape accelerators work: Thanks! I put this into wiki for developers to benefit. Please everyone, if you have grokked some aspect of the program well enough, please take time to document it on wiki. So, Mental, what is your advice for alt-x and alt-z - add gtk accelerators or manually send focus to specific widgets? I tend to think the latter would be simpler, and I don't think that much more "activate widget" actions will be needed anyway. _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/photos&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjo…

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] Patch to tidy up the print destination dialog
by bulia byak 11 Jan '04

11 Jan '04

>Just checked out inkscape and noticed that the Print Destination dialog >that does three things Thanks, applied. Actually printing has more severe problems at the moment (see bug 850936), but any help is appreciated :) _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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Patch to tidy up the print destination dialog
by iain 11 Jan '04

11 Jan '04

Hi guys, Just checked out inkscape and noticed that the Print Destination dialog that does three things 1) Capitalises the whole dialog name "to Print Destination" rather than "Print destination" 2) Removes the separator 3) Switches the Print and Cancel buttons around to fit with the GNOME HIG (Dunno if you're wanting to follow it, but the Open/Save dialogs are using it for their button arrangements) iain

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Survey: Motivations to Contribute
by Ralph Spitzer 11 Jan '04

11 Jan '04

Hi all! I'm doing a research project on the motives of free software / open source software developers. This survey follows a somewhat different approach than some earlier studies and tries to incorporate concepts of social psychology to better understand the internal motivation of developers. The questionnaire consists of 44 questions which should be scored on a scale from 1 to 7. According to test runs, completion of the questionnaire should take about 6 minutes. No registration required. The questionnaire and more information about the survey can be found here: *** http://foss-survey.at.tf *** The survey will be online until the end of January. I hope to have the results online by mid February. If you want to be notified, please enter your email address in the appropriate box. If you have questions or comments about this survey, please CC me or email me directly, because I won't be able to follow all the lists/forums. Thank you. Your help is greatly appreciated. ralph

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More cosmetics
by bulia byak 11 Jan '04

11 Jan '04

* More screen real estate: you can now hide rulers (Ctrl+R) and scrollbars (Ctrl+B). These settings are not yet stored in prefs but are planned to. I also added three toggle commands (grid, rulers, scrollbars) to the View menu. One missing command is toggle guides - it's still broken. Someone needs to look into it. I also removed the 3D border from the canvas frame, so now the rulers (when they're on) look less bulky and intrusive. _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/photos&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjo…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] screenshot-ready
by bulia byak 11 Jan '04

11 Jan '04

>>>It seems like the icon for the far left "Zoom drawing if window size >>>changes" is not taking up all the space of the widget. >> >> >>This button is planned for elimination anyway, there will be a global >>switch to that effect in preferences instead. > >Do you think so? I think both behaviours are common and would be better >serviced by an accessible button. Of course, I'm not a big user of >inkscape, so I am happy if I'm wrong. This switch makes sense for an SVG viewer - in it, if you resize a window, you want the drawing to resize as well, if only because you have no other ways to zoom or pan it. With an editor, your window is indeed a _window_ showing you the part of the landscape you're working on; and of course when you open your window wider or narrower the landscape does not change. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] screenshot-ready
by bulia byak 11 Jan '04

11 Jan '04

>It seems like the icon for the far left "Zoom drawing if window size >changes" is not taking up all the space of the widget. This button is planned for elimination anyway, there will be a global switch to that effect in preferences instead. >Also, it seems like the status bar text should be vertically aligned in >the center to flow with vertical alignment with the other elements at >the bottom of the document window. That would be perfect, but I could not find a way to affect the vertical padding or alignment of a gtk_statusbar. Any advice from the GTK experts in the audience? :) BTW, Jon, any progress with the Help menu? I would love to have at least the keyboard shortcuts and the man page there for the upcoming release. The keyboard shortcuts page is the most important - it may well be sufficient for clueful users to learn the entire program even without the manual. Will the help menu commands call a browser on an HTML page? If so I wll prepare a better formatted version of the shortcuts page in HTML. _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/photos&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjo…

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screenshot-ready
by bulia byak 11 Jan '04

11 Jan '04

I've just committed a few cosmetic changes to the document window, mostly reducing the font size of things. IMHO it looks very awkward and unprofessional when everything uses the same font size. Another advantage is a bit more screen space for the image itself. Comments welcome. In particular, I simplified the ruler pango code by Daniel Borgmann so that now it uses a fixed font size (defined in widgets/widget-sizes.h) instead of trying to determine the default GTK font size. This makes sense, because everything else in the ruler has fixed pixel sizes, so the font must be fixed too. The zoom spinbutton is now finally editable again (using the same code as the top panel spinbuttons). I will assign alt-z to jump to it when I figure out the gtk accelerators (or decide that they are not worth the trouble and implement it via a verb). The coordinate display now uses gtk_label instead of statusbar. This gives better alignment and removes the border which helps differentiate it from the real statusbar (which now has more space to itself). Mental, will you please comment out the detachability of the top panel for now, as we discussed? Anyone has any idea of this bug: https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=874205&group_id=9… This looks like a GTK problem to me, but maybe there's a smart trick that would get rid of that. It's minor but annoying. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] 4 signals sent from sliders
by bulia byak 11 Jan '04

11 Jan '04

>The color sliders emit four different signals: > >grabbed >dragged >released >changed > >However, comparable GTK+ widgets only emit a single signal: > >changed > >and follow up with a gboolean xxx_is_adjusting() function. I'm not sure, but the best way to test is to try disabling the extra signals and see if something will break. Commit the change and we'll try to find anything wrong with it. _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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new keys for the panel
by bulia byak 11 Jan '04

11 Jan '04

The panel The panel at the top of the document window displays a different set of fields and controls for each tool. * Alt+x jump to the first editable field in the secondary toolbar * Enter set the current field's new value (if changed) and leave the secondary toolbar * Esc cancel any changes in the current field and leave the secondary toolbar * Ctrl+z cancel any changes in the current field * Tab, Shift+Tab jump between fields in the secondary toolbar (the value in the field you leave, if changed, is set) * Up/Down arrows change the current value by 0.1 * PgUp/PgDn change the current value by 5.0 This is the basic set of keybindings that makes the panel (aka secondary toolbar, but I like the "panel" term better) usable. Some of this functionality was provided by GTK but had to be cleaned up, some was implemented from scratch. Not to start a flamewar, but my impression of GTK so far is not too favorable: messy, underdocumented, somewhat similar to GIMP itself in its "interface" (I mean the programmer's interface, not only GUI). I don't know if other toolkits are much better, though. Questions for everyone: - alt-x: I like this shortcut, but if anyone will propose a better one I will be glad to hear. - Is alt-x plus tab/shift-tab enough for navigating the toolbar, or do we want each widget to have its own shortcut? Or will this be too much, with potentially tens of widgets in all tools? Of course such shortcuts would use consistent modifiers and would correspond to the widget labels, e.g. for the selector toolbar: ctrl-alt-x, ctrl-alt-y, ctrl-alt-w, ctrl-alt-h. - Now alt-x is implemented very stupidly, through grab_focus of a specific widget. I tried to use GTK "accelerators" but was unable to make them work. Does anyone know if Inkscape uses GTK accelerators? If not, how are the global verbs implemented? If I manage to add an accelerator group to the top-level document window, will it conflict with verbs? Can one point me to a not-too-complex GTK app that uses accelerators so I could figure it out? (The documentation is very scarce.) P.S. I've tried to send this message several times. Guess what, sourceforge was rejecting it as spam because in the phrase "through grab_focus" I had "via" instead of "through" - which matched the regexp for some well-known substance name! Oh my. Hope it will pass through this time. _________________________________________________________________ Check out the new MSN 9 Dial-up � fast & reliable Internet access with prime features! http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=dialup/home&ST=1

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4 signals sent from sliders
by Jon A.Cruz 11 Jan '04

11 Jan '04

The color sliders emit four different signals: grabbed dragged released changed However, comparable GTK+ widgets only emit a single signal: changed and follow up with a gboolean xxx_is_adjusting() function. I was wondering if there is any reason for the 4-signal method, and whether or not we should keep or lose it.

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test
by bulia byak 10 Jan '04

10 Jan '04

test -- ___________________________________________________________ Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm

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Sodipodi flags 1.6
by Christian Schaller 10 Jan '04

10 Jan '04

Sodipodi flags 1.6 This is the fourth release of the Sodipodi flag collection. This collection currently consist of over 300 different international and local flags. The flags are donated by their authors into the public domain. The flags are in the scalable and free SVG format which today is supported by most major vector graphics programs. Most flags are done using the Sodipodi vector drawing application. In others words these are free flags in a free format made with a free application. The core collection of flags in this collection are meant to be as accurate as possible. If you discover flags in here that have wrong proportions or wrong colors then please update the flag with the correct colors or sizes and send it to us with an explanation. New flags are of course also welcomed, but remember we need a clear statement from you that you dedicate the flag to the public domain, preferably using the Creative Commons public domain dedication process found here: http://creativecommons.org/license/publicdomain-2 We do hope that many of you take some time to help us make this an evenmore complete collection; for instance the missing international flags per ISO 3166 are: bm, BERMUDA ky, CAYMAN ISLANDS fk, FALKLAND ISLANDS (MALVINAS) sh, SAINT HELENA tc, TURKS AND CAICOS ISLANDS vg, VIRGIN ISLANDS, BRITISH We hope that this collection can be useful to people in many different settings be that in relation to software, publishing, education and so on. The assembly of this huge collection has been made possible thanks to the hard work of many people. We big thank you goes to all our contributors listed in the CREDITS file distributed with this package. We would especially like to thank Tobias Jacobs who contributed most of the new flags for this release. You can see all of the currently contributed flags here: http://www.sodipodi.com/index.php3?section=clipart/flags The creation of these flags had not been possible without the hard work that free software coders have put into great tools like Sodipodi, Inkscape and librsvg. The projects have helped increase the viability of SVG in free and open source software a lot. Both these two tools and the new Inkscape project do need more coders in order to improve further. For instance thanks to the help of Caleb Moore so does the latest versions of Nautilus(librsvg) render all these flags perfectly. People interested in working on these and other issues are highly encouraged to join the project mailing-lists. You find the projects here: http://www.sodipodi.org http://librsvg.sf.net http://www.inkscape.org You can download the package in either tar.gz or zip format from the sourceforge file area: http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/sodipodi/sodipodi-flags-1.6.tar.bz2?down… http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/sodipodi/sodipodi-flags-1.6.zip?download

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Call for MS Windows peoples
by Jon A.Cruz 09 Jan '04

09 Jan '04

There are a few things for win32 builds that I have been starting to get hammered out. However, I'd probably need some help with it (as I don't think just editing and checking in my changes from Linux would be the best way) So... I'd like to make a call for all present and potential Windows users. If you can compile Inkscape yourself or not, doesn't matter. I'd just like to find who can help maybe just run it on different setups. Windows 95/98/ME users are especially needed. Of people who can compile Inkscape for Win32, we'd like to know your exact setup. It would be nice to be able to try it on a few different build pathways. If you want to just sound off, you can reply directly to me at jon@...155...

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] Warning / bug in nodepath.cpp
by bulia byak 09 Jan '04

09 Jan '04

>Anyway, there is a warning that 'xn' and 'xp' are >used unitialized in nodepath.cpp at line 2081. >There are several places in SP/Ink code where apparently >the author expects an uninitialized double to be 0.0, >and I thought this was one of them. On closer >inspection, the troublesome code is the following. At >the indicated line, if xn and xp are 0.0, that would >make the condition always false. It would be, and >probably is, the same as an '#IF 0'. I doubt if >that is the intention. What should we do? Thanks for the catch! I think it's my oversight. I will now fix this. _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/photos&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjo…

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RE: [Inkscape-devel] Win32 & SHGetSpecialFolderPath()
by bulia byak 09 Jan '04

09 Jan '04

>Creates > >\Windows\Profiles\%USER%\Application Data\Inkscape I have windows directory named c:\win98se. Is this covered? _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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Warning / bug in nodepath.cpp
by Bob Jamison 09 Jan '04

09 Jan '04

I was going through some files, and cleaning up the minor warnings we get with -Wall. However, some are not minor! (-Wall is good. -Wall is our friend!) Anyway, there is a warning that 'xn' and 'xp' are used unitialized in nodepath.cpp at line 2081. There are several places in SP/Ink code where apparently the author expects an uninitialized double to be 0.0, and I thought this was one of them. On closer inspection, the troublesome code is the following. At the indicated line, if xn and xp are 0.0, that would make the condition always false. It would be, and probably is, the same as an '#IF 0'. I doubt if that is the intention. What should we do? Bob node_request (SPKnot *knot, NRPoint *p, guint state, gpointer data) { SPPathNode * n; double yn, xn, yp, xp; double an, ap, na, pa; double d_an, d_ap, d_na, d_pa; gboolean collinear = FALSE; NRPoint c; NRPoint pr; n = (SPPathNode *) data; if (state & GDK_CONTROL_MASK) { // constrained motion ##### THIS LINE #######: if (state & GDK_MOD1_MASK && !(xn == 0 && xp == 0)) { // sliding on handles, only if at least one of the... // calculate relative distances of control points yn = n->n.pos.y - n->pos.y; xn = n->n.pos.x - n->pos.x; if (xn < 0) { xn = -xn; yn = -yn; } // limit the ....

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