- Inkscape Devel - Inkscape Mailman

Jabber, Email, Wiki, and Website
by Bryce Harrington 06 Nov '03

06 Nov '03

Communication is key for the success of any team effort, and in open source projects, written communication is critical for success. Briefly I'd like to explain the different communication channels we have, in case some are unfamiliar with them. === Jabber === Chat is a convenient, immediate, and free-form way of exchanging information, and we make heavy use of it. For fun we decided to try out Jabber and liked it enough that we've continued to use it. Details about getting started with it are on the website. We'd like to know if people would prefer IRC, though. If enough people cannot or do not wish to use Jabber, then we should switch to IRC. Please speak up if you have an opinion on this. If you have a good discussion in chat that you think others might be interested in, consider sending a copy of the log to the mailing list. === Email Lists === Email is preferred for information that needs wider visibility, such as things that will require discussion in preparation for making decisions. The mailing lists are also archived, so new developers can review past discussions to get up to speed. If you see or write a good email on a topic that people will wish to refer to longer in the future, consider pasting a copy of it into Wiki, so that it'll be easier for people to find and maintain later. === Wiki === Wiki is the new discussion medium we're introducing. A Wiki is a website that can be edited and added to by anyone. It's like a virtual whiteboard, and that's how we want to use it. It's good for gaining wide visibility and its more persistant than email (no having to browse through archives). Wiki's are great for capturing info quickly and semi-permanently, and for writing collaboratively. This makes them perfect for brainstorming and hashing out plans, designs, floating proposals, etc. Wiki's can get a bit chaotic over time, and for people with only a quick interest in the project they can be too much effort to search through for "official" information. So, if a page in Wiki becomes 'official' enough that it needs higher visibility and/or more formality, consider turning it into a proper web page. === Website === The website is simple flat HTML files, using SSI to put the header and footer on. It's stored in the CVS module inkscape_web. Anyone with CVS commit permissions can and is encouraged to make changes to the website. Changes to the website are posted to the inkscape-cvs@ mailing list. Each communication medium has its strengths and weaknesses. If we are all good about using them appropriately, and promoting information from one to the next where beneficial, it will give Inkscape a great communication infrastructure. Miscommunication is a leading cause of trouble in projects, so it is well worth our effort to work to prevent them from occurring. Bryce

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Exciting!
by Jonathan Phillips 06 Nov '03

06 Nov '03

I have to say that INKSCAPE is very exciting! I really dig the name and the opening up rather than the bottlenecking of development is going to help. EXCELLENT! jon -- Jon Phillips UCSD Graduate Researcher Computational Media PO BOX 948667 La Jolla, Ca 92037 858.361.2811 www.protofunk.org jon@...15...

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Re: Re: more infos
by Cédric GEMY 06 Nov '03

06 Nov '03

-- Sorry if we misunderstood, I've to improve my english. For the manual, if there is a different UI in Sodipodi and in Inkspace, there's no trouble, if fonctions are the same, files are the same. The only things to do is to create a different file for Inkscape in there's some difference. In fact, since the manual is written in XML Docbook, the only need is to add an attribute specifying if the information is going for Sodipodi or Inkscape. Pages are automatically generated following this. But this was just a idea. In the future I'll use sourceforge tools, ans less the mailing list. But on the site, I didn't find no direct link to trackers and forums I had to follow the links in the project info section of the wiki Cédric

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Re : more infos about Inkscape
by Cédric GEMY 06 Nov '03

06 Nov '03

Hi Bryce and everybody, I knew that Sodipodi has to be transferred to C++, but not it'd become a new project. Will Inskape be a standalone project, at the end completeley different from Sodipodi. If it is the case, why did you decide to make this new project ? What will it include in the future ? Will it tend so interactivity or animations edition ? Will it be compliant with SVG sub-recommandations as SVG-print ( is that the 'Ink') or SVG-Mobile? Who are the people developping Inkscape ? Are other people needed ? In which case and particular need ? Etc... I can try helping if the code is reasonably commented. At this time I'm still working on Sodipodi User Manual. I'm considering it as a free document. Since Inkscape has the same features than Sodipodi, and if it is convincing you, it can be intergrated as Inkscape Documentation. Friendly, Cédric

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Updates to Inkscape website
by Bryce Harrington 05 Nov '03

05 Nov '03

I added super preliminary FAQ and screenshot pages, and fleshed out the homepage with some news items. http://www.inkscape.org/ Bryce

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C++ fixes (mostly) complete
by MenTaLguY 03 Nov '03

03 Nov '03

I've essentially finished the C++ conversion; the only thing I had to give up on for now was getting spsvgview to build. I've disabled it for the present. The main application itself seems to work fine, at any rate. -mental

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tag
by MenTaLguY 03 Nov '03

03 Nov '03

By the way, I've tagged the version of the conversion that works for me with the tag 'g++-conversion'. -mental

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Objective for milestone 1
by Bryce Harrington 02 Nov '03

02 Nov '03

Given the amount of work the g++ conversion has taken, I'm simplifying the focus for milestone 1 to be completion and release of the g++ conversion and getting the website up to snuff. I think those are probably the two most important things right now, since a release and a website are prereqs to getting others involved. What do you guys think? I've listed some items for Milestone 2 but consider them extremely preliminary. I'm figuring that once we've got the C++ conversion securely under our belts, we're going to want some breathing time to do some random R&D, cleanup, etc. etc. so I think keeping the tasks for M2 flexible would be a good thing. Feel free to shove things that seem uninteresting/unimportant to you to the future, or move up or add things you are drawn to working on. Thinking beyond that to mid-term strategies, I figure we're going to want to have a mix of feature, architecture, and test development, and select a specific effort for each of these areas to focus on. Whatever work is selected for the architecture development, lets make sure to do it on a branch, as this type of work is the most likely to require leaving the tree in a broken state for a long time. Bryce

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Project Status
by Bryce Harrington 02 Nov '03

02 Nov '03

We're off to a good solid start. Milestone 0 is nearly done - we just need to wrestle Mental into posting 'experimental' ;-). We've got the codebase compiling under g++ now, and are down to linker errors. While it's turned out to be quote a battle, we're showing good teamwork that is bound to benefit us with future efforts. The Hydra branch got accepted and integrated into the Sodipodi codebase, which nicely validates our earlier efforts. The SourceForge project has been configured up, and we've got a first stab at a website. Several other Sodipodi developers have been notified of our intent; I've only heard from oka though, so I suspect we need to prove our mettle before gaining their support. Statistics ========== Lifetime Rank on SourceForge: 6103 (56.2%) Week's Rank on SourceForge: 6023 (56.8%) Lines of Code in src/: 115,754 Lines of Docs in doc/: 1,135 Lines of content in website: 74 Days since last ChangeLog mod: 4 Bugs open/closed: 0/0 Features open/closed: 0/0 Patches open/closed: 0/0 CVS Commits (as per inkscape-cvs): 148 Inkscape-devel membership: 4 Development Roadmap - Current Milestone 0 =================== Inkscape Production: * (DONE) Post hydra-october patchset to Sodipodi mailing list [bryce] * (DONE) Import sodipodi into inkscape CVS as module 'inkscape' from hydra-october [mental] * (DONE) Unsodipodify the tree, replacing instances of 'Sodipodi' with 'Inkscape' where appropriate (we will be keeping the sodipodi XML namespace for compatibility) [mental] * (DONE) Install inkscape 0.00 for personal use [bryce] * (DONE) Install inkscape 0.00 for personal use [mental] * (DONE) Install inkscape 0.00 for personal use [ted] * (DONE) Install inkscape 0.00 for personal use [njh] * (DONE) Decide what release number N to use (0.00? 0.33? 0.35? 1.00?) - we'll use 0.35 Inkscape Experimental * (DONE) Decide name for Mental's sketch 'inkscape-experimental'? 'experimental'? 'inkscape-next-gen'? -- It shall be called 'experimental' [mental] * Import code into CVS [mental] Inkscape Website * (DONE) Set up a Wiki [bryce] * (DONE) Post sketchy website with homepage, contact info, news, and pointer to wiki [bryce] * (DONE) Set up website to auto-rebuild every few minutes [bryce]

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Re: [Sodipodi-list] Karbon14: Bool-Ops, SVG-Import (fwd)
by Bryce Harrington 30 Oct '03

30 Oct '03

May be worth checking out the codebase of Karbon to scope out if it'd be worth borrowing code/algorithms from it. I've added a task to wiki to do so. Bryce ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2003 11:33:19 +0300 From: yemu@...7... To: sodipodi-list(a)lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Sodipodi-list] Karbon14: Bool-Ops, SVG-Import > I just read some information about the upcoming K-Office 1.3, which contains a vector drawing app called Karbon14: > http://www.koffice.org/karbon/ karbon 14 seems to be very interesting app. hopefully it'll be possible to use boolops code (or other like eps import) from them. it looks like karbon is a little ahead of Sodipodi, so maybe itwould be possible to use what they have done already. best regards yemu ------------------------------------------------------- This SF.net email is sponsored by: SF.net Giveback Program. Does SourceForge.net help you be more productive? Does it help you create better code? SHARE THE LOVE, and help us help YOU! Click Here: http://sourceforge.net/donate/ _______________________________________________ Sodipodi-list mailing list Sodipodi-list(a)lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/sodipodi-list

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latest commits
by Nathan Hurst 30 Oct '03

30 Oct '03

I've been working my way through sodipodi making everything work with g++. At this point I have done: libnr/* libnrtype/* inkscape.c Not complete, but partly working: helpers widgets to test, just change the CC=gcc line in the makefile and make clean && make the aim is to have inkscape compile both in gcc and g++. biggest problem is _(). most effort has been fixing variables named 'new' and 'class' and sorting out the various string types. I also found a bug thanks to the type system (two params swapped) :). njh

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Planned tasks for milestone 0
by Bryce Harrington 30 Oct '03

30 Oct '03

Given that we really just started this yesterday, it's impressive how far we've got so suddenly. The remaining tasks for this milestone are quite modest, and I think we could quite easily get them finished up today and have our first milestone behind us. :-) Bryce === Milestone 0 === Inkscape Production: * (DONE) Post hydra-october patchset to Sodipodi mailing list [bryce] * (DONE) Import sodipodi into inkscape CVS as module 'inkscape' from hydra-october [mental] * (DONE) Unsodipodify the tree, replacing instances of 'Sodipodi' with 'Inkscape' where appropriate (we will be keeping the sodipodi XML namespace for compatibility) [mental] * (DONE) Install inkscape 0.00 for personal use [bryce] * (DONE) Install inkscape 0.00 for personal use [mental] * Install inkscape 0.00 for personal use [ted] * Install inkscape 0.00 for personal use [njh] * Decide what release number N to use (0.00? 0.33? 1.00?) [mental] Inkscape Experimental * (DONE) Decide name for Mental's sketch 'inkscape-experimental'? 'experimental'? 'inkscape-next-gen'? -- It shall be called 'experimental' [mental] * Import code into CVS [mental] Inkscape Website * (DONE) Set up a Wiki [bryce] * (DONE) Post sketchy website with homepage, contact info, news, and pointer to wiki [bryce] * (DONE) Set up website to auto-rebuild every few minutes [bryce]

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CVS commit diff
by Bryce Harrington 30 Oct '03

30 Oct '03

I expect most people already know this but in case not here's a trick to get cvs commit to display a diff of what you're checking in: Create a file called ~/bin/cvsdiffedit: ---------------------------------- #!/bin/bash echo Building diff... cvs diff -u 2>/dev/null | perl -ne 'print "CVS: $_" unless /^\?/' >> $1 exec emacs $1 ---------------------------------- (Change 'emacs' to your favorite editor) Then put this in your .cshrc: ---------------------------------- ... if (-e $HOME/bin/cvsdiffedit) then setenv CVSEDITOR "$HOME/bin/cvsdiffedit" endif ... ---------------------------------- Or if you use BASH or similar: ---------------------------------- ... export CVSEDITOR=~/bin/cvsdiffedit ... ---------------------------------- Bryce

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Website auto-rebuild
by Bryce Harrington 30 Oct '03

30 Oct '03

The website is set to auto-update every couple minutes. To modify the website, check out inkscape_web, cd into src/, add or edit files and directories as desired, and do cvs commit. Docs on the EtText format are available from ettext.taint.org. Bryce

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New mailing lists
by Bryce Harrington 30 Oct '03

30 Oct '03

I've added two "auto-notify" mailing lists. inkscape-tracker@...6... is configured to get CC'd for all Bug, Patch, or Feature Request submissions sent by users. Useful for keeping in touch with what users are wanting. inkscape-cvs@...6... gets sent every CVS commit message. Useful for tracking what developers are doing. Enjoy, Bryce

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Install inkscape
by Bryce Harrington 30 Oct '03

30 Oct '03

Now that Mental has imported inkscape into CVS, I recommend that each of us make an effort to download, compile, and install it within the next few days, and to force ourselves to start using it instead of sodipodi for all of our own personal vector drawing needs. I've created tasks for each of us to do this, on the plan. Please mark them (DONE) when you've finished installing it on your system. http://www.inkscape.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?DevelopmentRoadmap Bryce

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Skeleton website
by Bryce Harrington 30 Oct '03

30 Oct '03

I blatantly stole the web structure, etc. from OSDL for us. http://www.inkscape.org/ I expect we'll chuck the color and look & feel stuff, but this gives us the basic structure, navigational elements, etc. This is checked into cvs as inkscape_web. This doesn't use php, so our URL's are going to be like normal URLs instead of hanging everything off of an index.php?foo=bar type thing. Since it uses TT2 we can still do a lot of the same scripting type stuff that can be done in PHP, only without any processing overhead. Bryce

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Copyright assignment policy
by Bryce Harrington 30 Oct '03

30 Oct '03

It is a common misconception that one should list as copyright holder for docs, sourcecode, etc. the name of the project, unless it is an actual legal entity. Obviously, 99% of open source projects aren't legal entities. Likewise, Inkscape isn't and probably won't be a legal entity, so can't hold copyright. Assigning copyright of something to a non-legal entity invalidates it. If there would ever happen to be any question of copyright, this would make it difficult to chase down who really holds the copyright. So ironically by trying to do something nice for the project it could cause more problems than it solves. Thank god that this is almost never ever an issue since open source projects rarely get into legal troubles. Instead, list yourself as the author and copyright holder for things you make, and make sure to declare it GPL'd. (If you wish, you can dual license with yourself and Inkscape if for some reason you're optimistic that one day someone will bother to file the papers to make it a legal entity.) Also take care to provide good contact info so folks can track you down 10 years from now if, for instance, they needed to assign you a bunch of stock options or something. ;-) Bryce

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hydra is in CVS
by MenTaLguY 30 Oct '03

30 Oct '03

Just a quick note to let you guys know I've imported Hydra into CVS as module 'inkscape'. -mental

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DNS and other things
by MenTaLguY 29 Oct '03

29 Oct '03

I've finished twiddling DNS for inkscape.org to point at our SF webspace, I think, though it'll take a while for things to settle down and propagate. I've also added email aliases @inkscape.org for each of the currently added developers (y'all let me know if you object). Also, I'd like to congratulate bryce on his perennial state of being-on-the-ball with this mailing list thing and getting more folks added, so I didn't have to. ^_^ Next up is probably getting the goodies in CVS. I'm strongly in favor of labeling the Sodipodi fork "hydra", but I'm not sure what to call the piece of code I'm working on. I'd originally been thinking "hercules", but maybe just "inkscape" is fine? Also, is anyone any good with Doxygen? I'd like to start looking into that for both codebases... -mental

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"Invariants"
by Bryce Harrington 29 Oct '03

29 Oct '03

The book "Open Source Development with CVS" is IMHO the best source of good, solid advice about starting and running open source projects. (The odd numbered chapters talk about cvs, the even ones about open source dev.) For starting a new project one of the key things it recommends is to choose the "Invariants" for the project. That is to say, certain base assumptions that define with some specificity what the project will be (and, on the flip side, what it _won't_ be.) This is important because it helps potential users and developers in setting their expectations and determining if the project is worth their effort. Typical invariants would be file formats, programming languages, and key underlying libraries. Processes and policies could also be invariants if they would play a large role in how decisions are made in the project. The trick is to select specific enough invariants to make it easy to pigeon-hole the project, without painting yourself into a corner. Typical mistakes would be picking a programming language you're not totally familiar with, or a new library that you haven't discovered its quirks yet, or selecting hardware performance criteria that make sense today but turn out to be anemic and silly when you finally hit 1.00. Based on our discussions so far, it looks like the invariants might be: * Full SVG compliance * Core coded in C/C++ * Gtk-compliant user interface * Extensible using various scripting languages * Open, community-oriented development processes * Baseline is the Sodipodi 0.32 codebase * Strives to use commonly available libraries Thoughts? More? Less? I think the first three in particular are important items to establish firmly, because they are the types of things that can get endlessly argued back and forth and back again, until months path with zero results. Establishing them as invariants allows us all to admit and agree that C and C++ suck, and lets us get down to coding in them anyway. ;-) Bryce

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Inkscape Wiki now available
by Bryce Harrington 29 Oct '03

29 Oct '03

http://inkscape.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?HomePage If you've used Wiki before, have at it, you know the drill. If not, click the 'edit' link and write what comes to mind. Bryce

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frist psot
by MenTaLguY 29 Oct '03

29 Oct '03

(or not)

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Welcome!
by Bryce Harrington 28 Oct '03

28 Oct '03

First post. ;-) Bryce

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