- Inkscape Devel - Inkscape Mailman

Re: [Inkscape-devel] menu idea
by bulia byak 25 Dec '03

25 Dec '03

>Please remember that in some languages, the menu names will be about >twice their current width. Do you really want the document window >forced to be that wide? Currently the menu takes about 25% of my screen horizontally, so we definitely have some room to grow. Besides, we'll also have much more stuff in the secondary toolbar that will also stretch the window horizontally (although of course we must be very thrifty with space there and add important things closer to the left side) >Forgetting for the moment what the standard widgets can currently do, >what do you think the best way to deal with uncomfortably wide menus is? I don't think it's an issue at this time. Inkscape will have big menus inevitably, since it's a complex application. Gimp now has 10 menus; it simply cuts the menubar when window is resized small - I don't like that, I'd prefer the menus to be reflown in 2 or more lines (does GTK support that?) _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/features&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin…

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menu idea
by bulia byak 24 Dec '03

24 Dec '03

With the View menu moved, I think it makes sense to serparate its list of dialogs into a separate menu Dialogs, to be put after Object. And I'd like to separate Object into Object (grouping, order, and transformation commands) and Path (everything else). What do you think? This makes 8 menus overall, which is not too many I think. With this arrangement, it seems to be much easier to find a place for a new command (there hopefully will be many). _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.ms…

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item-specific context menuitems
by MenTaLguY 24 Dec '03

24 Dec '03

Just a quick note -- in HEAD, I've removed the per-class submenus from the context menu and lumped the menuitems onto the main context menu. This still doesn't really fix the problems with the context menu, but at least it's moderately less crappy now. -mental

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google's opinion
by bulia byak 24 Dec '03

24 Dec '03

> > >Other obvious HIG issues which I didn't touch yet: > > >- The shortcut labels are non-standard. :) Aside from the already > > >mentioned lowercase letters, they also use the wrong ordering sometimes > > >(Ctrl+Shift+C would be Shift+Ctrl+C in other Gtk applications) or wrong > > >names (PgUp should be Page_Up). Google gives: 4230 pages for "ctrl shift p" 1020 pages for "shift ctrl p" and even 24 pages for "ctrl shift p" +gnome 15 pages for "shift ctrl p" +gnome So even within gnome, ctrl-shift wins :) _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/features&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] User Interface(was: save confirm dialog)
by bulia byak 24 Dec '03

24 Dec '03

>However, I currently have done some changes which I'd like to commit if >you are fine with them, so here they are: > >- Fixed some capitalization mistakes ("Remove transformations" -> >"Remove Transformations", etc) I left these because I'm still undecided on whether we want the Initial Caps style. To me it sounds old-fashioned and clunky, I would like to change everything to First cap only. But it's not something I feel too strongly about, so if HIG mandates Initial Caps without exceptions, I can live with that. >and added ellipses were appropriate (like >"Import..." and "Export Bitmap...") OK >. I also changed "x:x" in the View >menu to "Zoom x:x" as in Totem. We shouldn't take it too far with the >abbreviations. ;) OK >- Added mnemonics. For this I had to change some functions to their >_with_mnemonic counterpart and also had to add some underscores to many >action names (for example "Open" would become "_Open"). I hope this is >not a problem. It should only be a problem, if those action names are >meant to used at places where mnemonics can't be used. And if they are, >we have a major problem. Wonderful, I meant to do this myself but never had the time. Just check the KeyboardShortcuts wiki page to see if there are any conflicts, and if not we're probably fine (and we tried to avoid alt-letter shortcuts, so there should not be many conflicts if any). >- Changed the position of the "View" and "Object" menus. View is a >standard menu which should come at the third position according to the >HIG, application specific menus should come after the standard menus. Hmm. OK. >- Removed shortcut labels from the context menu. This is according to >the HIG to reduce clutter. Disagree. "Reduce clutter" is not a strong enough argument for me. The sooner the user will learn shortcuts, the more productive he will be, so I'd like to use any opportunity to remind the shortcuts. >The whole menu stuff in Inkscape seems to be pretty non-standard and I >wonder if it wouldn't be worth simplifying the code (maybe using the new >action-based API from libegg which will be in Gtk 2.3?). I mostly don't >like the way how items with shortcuts are constructed as a new >container, as this makes it impossible for Gtk to properly space the >menus (notice how in other Gtk apps, the item labels never overlap with >the shortcut labels of other items, but they do in Inkscape). Without overlapping, I think some menus may become too wide. But it's a minor point, so if you can make the menu code more standard (and ideally simpler), go ahead. >Other obvious HIG issues which I didn't touch yet: >- The shortcut labels are non-standard. :) Aside from the already >mentioned lowercase letters, they also use the wrong ordering sometimes >(Ctrl+Shift+C would be Shift+Ctrl+C in other Gtk applications) or wrong >names (PgUp should be Page_Up). Order of modifiers: is this a HIG standard or simply "other apps do this"? If the former, well, OK. Otherwise, I like Ctrl-Shift better, because it seems to be standard on Windows, and besides it's more natural because it's the order in which most people actually press these keys (Ctrl, then Shift). So I'd like to leave this as is unless there's some strongly worded and convincingly argued standard on this. Key names: actually I wrote a special function (sp_key_name in interface.cpp) to translate from the ugly GDK names to normal ones. Mostly it replaces monsters like "asciicircum" by its character, i.e. "^", but also changes Page_Down. Reason: (1) it's overly long and unwieldy, (2) the "_" character is not really meant for user consumption, it's a programmer's device, and (3) PgUp/PgDn is standard on Windows. So I would like to keep this as is. >- The context menu is really bad. You probably know that already. :) The >main point of the context menu is to provide quick access to the most >commonly used action on an object. Most commonly used actions should be >at the top and sub menus should be avoided. Of course the current >context menu breaks all of this. :) This deserves some discussion and a >good plan IMO. Maybe a Wiki page? Yes. One idea I'm planning to do is a node context menu with common operations on a node. However I keep postponing this because I myself never use context menus, and you know... scratching your own itches etc. :) >- The title name of the app is "Inkscape: Documentname: base: X". >According to the HIG it should be either just "Documentname" or >"Documentname - Inkscape". I don't know yet what this "base: x" is >supposed to be, only that it looks odd. :) "base" is the namedview. I think we can drop it. But the digit must be kept, it the number of the view (call View/New view, it will show the same document with ": 2"). >- Toolbar is non-standard (also looks ugly with Bluecurve theme :/) Which one, primary or secondary? >- Storing window size when a window is closed and restoring this size >when a new window is opened. Currently new windows open way too small >for my resolution. Would that be ok? Done yesterday :) see my message "namedview news" >- Dialog reorganization. :) Should I know anything (besides what's >written on the Wiki pages) before I play around with this? Did anyone >already work on it? Nothing except that there were plans to switch us over to Gtkmm, so I postponed this until after the switch because I really don't know what is Gtkmm and how it's going to be different from the current code. However, perhaps the change will not be too drastic and hopefully automatic enough, so if you can work on dialogs now, that would be fantastic. Especially building the Preferences dialog (yesterday I split its wiki page into several sections, perhaps to be implemented as separate tabs; not all controls are ready to be implemented, but some are; those that are ready have the corresponding pref path in []; see the HandlingPreferences page for how to access the values). _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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Re: [Inkscape-devel] User Interface(was: save confirm dialog)
by bulia byak 24 Dec '03

24 Dec '03

>- Dialog reorganization. :) Should I know anything (besides what's >written on the Wiki pages) I've just updated the DialogsReorganization page. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoi…

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CVS Compilation - C++
by Thomas Ingham 24 Dec '03

24 Dec '03

Guys, When I attempt to compile the latest cvs running ./autogen I get the following message: I am testing that you have the required versions of libtool, autoconf, automake, glib-gettextize and intltoolize. This test is not foolproof, so if anything goes wrong, see the file HACKING for more information... checking for autoconf >= 2.52 ... yes (version 2.57) checking for automake >= 1.6 ... yes (version 1.6.3) checking for glib-gettextize >= 2.0.0 ... yes (version 2.2.1) checking for intltool >= 0.17 ... yes (version 0.27.2) Copying file po/Makefile.in.in Please add the files codeset.m4 gettext.m4 glibc21.m4 iconv.m4 isc-posix.m4 lcmessage.m4 progtest.m4 from the /sw/share/aclocal directory to your autoconf macro directory or directly to your aclocal.m4 file. You will also need config.guess and config.sub, which you can get from ftp://ftp.gnu.org/pub/gnu/config/. I have no idea what it means. Please help. -thomas

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Maillist Reply-to: setting
by Bob Jamison 24 Dec '03

24 Dec '03

Is it possible to admin the mail list so that there is a Reply-to: Inkscape Devel List <inkscape-devel(a)lists.sourceforge.net> header in the messages? In other words, shouldn't the default recipient of a reply be the list? Just wondering. Currently the replies are going to the sender by default. Bob

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GUADEC 2004 (follow-up)
by David Neary 24 Dec '03

24 Dec '03

Hi, I am helping organise the graphics stream of GUADEC 2004, which will also be the occasion for the GIMP developers conference 2004. You have all received the announcement calling for papers for the conference because you are prominent free or open source graphics software projects. I may have missed some projects. If so, please forward on the announcement to their devel lists. Many of you have some links with GNOME already, and others are working towards interoperability with all major desktops apps, including GNOME. I hope that we can see some people from each of these projects in Norway, and take the opportunity to make some headway on graphics application interoperability, which is an area which seems to be somewhat behind the rest of the desktop. Thank you, Dave. -- David Neary, E-Mail: dneary@...8... Tél: 04 72 33 95 35 Port: 06 03 98 39 80

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GUADEC 2004 Call for Papers
by David Neary 24 Dec '03

24 Dec '03

GUADEC 2004 CALL FOR PAPERS The Fifth European Gnome Users and Developers Conference June 28-30, 2004, Kristiansand, Norway http://guadec.org/ Abstract submission deadline: February 1st, 2004 The European Gnome Users and Developers Conference (GUADEC) invite you to participate in the Fifth Conference on June 28-30, 2004, Kristiansand, Norway The GNOME User and Developer European Conference (GUADEC) will bring together developers, GNOME Foundation leaders and individual, business and government GNOME and open source software users. The conference is a unique forum for highlighting the capabilities and direction of GNOME, the user environment for desktops, networked servers and portable Internet devices. GUADEC will also feature discussions of the future direction of open source development. We're looking for people to give - Talks, Tutorials, Posters, Panels, Planning Sessions / BOFS Areas of interest include, but are not limited to: GNOME core: Latest developments on the GNOME desktop, core GNOME applications, related libraries, security, Mobility and Wireless Access etc. Free Software in the Information Society: Development of policies and cases related to Patents, Open Standards, Migration strategies and experiences (e.g. Office documents), Software in Public sector such as schools and hospitals, Information Society progress including developing countries. Graphics: Development and deployment of applications in particular: Multimedia, Games, Film, GIMP Freestyle: Interesting Free Software issues not covered in the other tracks and open for a less formal forms of presentation REFEREED PAPERS TRACK GUADEC seeks original papers describing research in all areas based on GNOME or related to Open Source. Papers should not have been published or be in submission at another conference or journal. Accepted papers will appear on the Web site and we plan to publish them in conference proceedings. For papers to appear in the proceedings, we need to be strict on the submission format. Format details available on the above web site. Note that the Freestyle submissions can appear in the printed proceedings if the format requirements are fulfilled. Authors are required to GPL the copyright. PAPER SUBMISSION Authors of papers are invited to submit abstracts (150 - 400 words) in plain text, due February 1st 2004 Final papers (1500 - 4000 words) or maximum 5 pages, photo and biography, due May 15th 2004. Please send your submission to guadec-papers@...45... See http://2004.guadec.org/ for further details and information on Posters, Panels, and Planning Sessions / BOFS Kristiansand is situated on the Norwegian south coast, offering a city beach and a vivid summer town life. The most visited attraction in Norway, the zoo (Dyreparken), is located nearby Kristiansand. Here the animals are kept in large outdoor space instead of cages. Perhaps we can even find some gnu's there. For those who prefer an excursion to a waterfall and Salmon River this can be also arranged. Other options include concerts, visit to islands, etc. General questions about GUADEC may be sent to info@...133... -- David Neary, E-Mail: dneary@...8... Tél: 04 72 33 95 35 Port: 06 03 98 39 80

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